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Thread: A7rii S-Log profile?

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    Member Chris Barrett's Avatar
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    A7rii S-Log profile?

    If you're shooting motion (video) with the new Sony, the general preference is to shoot with the S-Log gamma profile to have a more gradable footage. Just setting this required much internet digging. Apparently, it's in Picture Profile #7.

    I was wondering, though, if anyone has tried this for stills?

    One of the strange things is that the setting forces the ISO to 800. The sensitivity, however, is a full two stops less than using No Picture Profile. Another oddity, is that the image has the same lack of noise as ISO 100.

    In the stills, I do feel like hilights have a gentler roll-off.

    What do you think? Go play!

    CB

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    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
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    Re: A7rii S-Log profile?

    Hi Chris

    Using such a flat Gamma for Photography is probably NOT giving any advantages. But - this may depend on your intended workflow (e.g. Timelapse photography !).
    here are the full infos Sony supplies for this - I think it is written fairly easy and understandable.

    https://pro.sony.com/bbsccms/assets/...log_manual.pdf

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    Stefan
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    Subscriber Member tashley's Avatar
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    Re: A7rii S-Log profile?

    I've used slog on the a7 for video and will do on the rII BUT I don't think it'll make any difference to a RAW file other than force you to shoot at ISO 800 when you don't need to. It will, if you have 'settings Effects >On, let you see into the shadows better in the EVF or LCD but that's probably about it
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    Re: A7rii S-Log profile?

    Although you may feel this type of workflow is helpful to you, the camera is designed for two different ways of capturing images for stills vs. video.

    I have an A7s and A7II that I use for both stills and video. When I take video footage, I use the PP7 setting exclusively as the video is a series of jpg frames that are already processed by the camera. Shooting the video in a flat, low contrast, desaturated fashion gives one the ability to increase contrast and saturation on the computer when editing ("grading") the final movie.

    For stills, an even better way to capture the best image data in the camera is to shoot RAW where the camera doesn't do any, or minimal processing, and complete the processing on the computer with the likes of Capture One or Lightroom.

    There are cameras that shoot RAW video either natively or with hacks (Canon 5D Mk II and III), but huge video file sizes and length of time for post-production limits their usefulness under most circumstances.

    Hope this helps.

    Michael
    Michael Rivers
    Leica Q, SL


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    Re: A7rii S-Log profile?

    Chris, how does the Sony work with the RED?

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    Member Chris Barrett's Avatar
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    Re: A7rii S-Log profile?

    I haven't tested it against my Red yet, but I'm guessing it has less dynamic range. The Epic has beat the pants off everything, including my IQ 260 (by a long shot).

    CB

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    Re: A7rii S-Log profile?

    Quote Originally Posted by tashley View Post
    I've used slog on the a7 for video and will do on the rII BUT I don't think it'll make any difference to a RAW file other than force you to shoot at ISO 800 when you don't need to. It will, if you have 'settings Effects >On, let you see into the shadows better in the EVF or LCD but that's probably about it
    The recent article in DPReview about A7RII ISO-invariance mentions using S-Log2 in a situation where you intend to push a RAW file a few stops (causing a preview that is too dark).

    In terms of regular shooting, I actually like how the preview in my A7II looks using Picture Profile 4 (which doesn't seem to have any ISO limitations) with Setting Effects On. The view seems lower in contrast, smoother somehow; more like an optical viewfinder. It's not all that different in look from turning the Neutral contrast setting down to -3, which is my default. Actually, using both those settings at the same time could result in extra low contrast in the viewfinder for difficult situations.

    I haven't seen any adverse effects in my RAW files from Picture Profiles so far, but I should probably leave them off anyway, in case they mess with bit depth or have some other gotcha I don't know about. If anybody knows more about using Picture Profiles for stills shooting, I'm curious....

    --d
    Last edited by davidstock; 24th August 2015 at 23:26.

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    Re: A7rii S-Log profile?

    I queried Rishi Sanyal of DPReview for more info about using S-Log2 for stills. Here is what he replied:

    By Rishi Sanyal (9 hours ago)

    Sure, you can read a little about it in the section titled 'S-Log2' in our RX100 IV review here: Sony Cyber-shot DSC-RX100 IV Review: Digital Photography Review

    The end of that section then links off to another more in-depth treatise on the concept within the same review.

    Hope this helps. It's really quite clever, and makes shooting in the manner I propose in this article here more practical.
    With the a7R II, when the camera says 'ISO 800', its hardware-level amplification is really more like ISO 100, so you know the camera is not throwing away much (any?) dynamic range, as cameras have the most dynamic range at base ISO. The ISO 800 setting the camera automatically jumps in to just ensures the camera purposefully underexposes the image by at least 3 EV, giving you at least 3 EV of highlight headroom.
    You can just use this mode to ETTR though (dial in as much exposure as you can before you see highlights clip), & then dark shadows are rendered visible by the extreme tone curve.



    I find this fascinating. The take-away seems to be that the S-Log2 setting is almost perfect for retaining dynamic range in high contrast situations. It does affect the RAW file, apparently. But it allows ETTR, uses low hardware amplification, and raises the shadows and mid-tones without clipping on the high end. Meanwhile, it allows the photographer to actually see a reasonable preview in the finder.

    Too good to be true?

    --d

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