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Sony Alpha MIS Strobe/Flash Options

dmward

Member
The Sony variant Godox 685 and X1T have shown up on eBay.
I just emailed my Godox source.
Hopefully the hardware will show up within a couple of weeks so I can start some evaluation.

Also on Amazon.

The XTR-16 and XTR16s are 2.4Ghz receivers for the older lights so they will be triggered by the new X1 system trigger.
 
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iiiNelson

Well-known member
Well that was "fast." The Priolite Remote HS for Sony was released last Friday so it's not a rumor any longer. We have one additional option as well now for naively syncing flash up to 1/8000 of a second.

http://priolite.us/rc-hsp-2-4ghz-hot-sync-remote-for-pentax/

The coolest thing about the Priolites IMO are that they are battery powered like Profoto B1's but can also be plugged into the wall if available like Profoto D1's. Speaking of Profoto, they've released a Profoto modifier adapter too. I don't know if it gives the "zooming" feature to the modifiers but it does make this a extremely flexible monolight that can be used with Priolite mount, Bowens-S mount, some Hensel mount, and most Profoto mount light modifiers

http://shop.priolite.us/item/profoto-adapter
 

dmward

Member
Well that was "fast." The Priolite Remote HS for Sony was released last Friday so it's not a rumor any longer. We have one additional option as well now for naively syncing flash up to 1/8000 of a second.

http://priolite.us/rc-hsp-2-4ghz-hot-sync-remote-for-pentax/
I looked at the specs for the HS version; flash duration is 1/200 (t.05) which means they are using a "HyperSync" like solution for the high shutter speed. The benefit is that the light is optimized for this operation. Interesting that they say x sync only with other triggers. I wonder how the lights would perform with another FP-sync trigger such as the Godox X1 or YN-622.

The coolest thing about the Priolites IMO are that they are battery powered like Profoto B1's but can also be plugged into the wall if available like Profoto D1's. Speaking of Profoto, they've released a Profoto modifier adapter too. I don't know if it gives the "zooming" feature to the modifiers but it does make this a extremely flexible monolight that can be used with Priolite mount, Bowens-S mount, some Hensel mount, and most Profoto mount light modifiers

http://shop.priolite.us/item/profoto-adapter
It appears that the Profoto adapter is a sleeve that fits the head placing the flash tube and dome inside the sleeve. It seems to me that the tube is too far back in the modifier for optimum performance.

Interesting product line, but pricey.
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
I looked at the specs for the HS version; flash duration is 1/200 (t.05) which means they are using a "HyperSync" like solution for the high shutter speed. The benefit is that the light is optimized for this operation. Interesting that they say x sync only with other triggers. I wonder how the lights would perform with another FP-sync trigger such as the Godox X1 or YN-622.


It appears that the Profoto adapter is a sleeve that fits the head placing the flash tube and dome inside the sleeve. It seems to me that the tube is too far back in the modifier for optimum performance.

Interesting product line, but pricey.
Yeah I agree and there are both "hot sync" versions with slower sync speeds and longer flash durations, as well as, normal versions with shorter flash durations that will sync perfectly fine with medium format systems that have leaf shutters.

The Profoto mount as you stated is a fitted collar to allow modifiers to be used with these lights. It may or may not be any worse than the B1/D1 built in reflectors. Maybe there's a frosted dome that can be added too down the line. I can't say but maybe this is the case with enough feedback.

I'm thinking about giving these lights a try soon and if I do then I'll post the results here. They are pricier than Godox/Cheetah/Adorama but I think that's because of German design/manufacturing (possibly). I'm still awaiting your tests on the Sony versions of the Godox rebrands. The Priolites are in line with the prices of the Phottix Pro Indras and many other moonlights that are considered mid to high end moonlights. I like the mount flexibility, the ability to shoot on location or be on wall power with the same unit without external battery generators, and the ability for the lights to work with at least the four brands currently supported.
 

dmward

Member
It will be interesting to see how they preform in what they call HS mode. The long burn suggests that they may have engineered the capacitor(s) to create a flatter than normal luminosity curve. I am taking on faith that their t05 reference means t.05 which means 95% of the capacitor energy has been used by the tube. If they mean t.5 (50%) then its a REALLY long burn. :)

Their pack approach is interesting as well. I'm planning to get the Godox extension cable for the AD600 which creates the same sort of configuration.

I looked at the video describing how they have implemented masking sequential exposing. Interesting implementation making Group D the means for accomplishing it. That suggests that there are effectively only 3 groups available for "normal" lighting.

I do think the trigger based implementation is easier. Godox using UNITS/ALT feature on the light offers more useful scenarios but doe take more work to setup since it requires going into the menu of each light.

I thought I saw a frosted dome in one of the product pix. That would be similar to the Profoto lights with the sunken tube. Generally, I'd rather change the adapter ring on the modifier than use the mount adapter approach. That does mean certain modifiers are unavailable though.
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
It will be interesting to see how they preform in what they call HS mode. The long burn suggests that they may have engineered the capacitor(s) to create a flatter than normal luminosity curve. I am taking on faith that their t05 reference means t.05 which means 95% of the capacitor energy has been used by the tube. If they mean t.5 (50%) then its a REALLY long burn. :)

Their pack approach is interesting as well. I'm planning to get the Godox extension cable for the AD600 which creates the same sort of configuration.

I looked at the video describing how they have implemented masking sequential exposing. Interesting implementation making Group D the means for accomplishing it. That suggests that there are effectively only 3 groups available for "normal" lighting.

I do think the trigger based implementation is easier. Godox using UNITS/ALT feature on the light offers more useful scenarios but doe take more work to setup since it requires going into the menu of each light.

I thought I saw a frosted dome in one of the product pix. That would be similar to the Profoto lights with the sunken tube. Generally, I'd rather change the adapter ring on the modifier than use the mount adapter approach. That does mean certain modifiers are unavailable though.
Yeah, I looked around and saw the frosted and clear domes on the Internet. I don't know that it'll be the end all as it doesn't provide TTL options like Godox, Phottix, or Profoto but it is one more option for Sony and that's great. Apparently they're working on a Phase One RC-HS as well. Who knows... Maybe they'll do a Leica and Fuji as well.
 

dmward

Member
Yeah, I looked around and saw the frosted and clear domes on the Internet. I don't know that it'll be the end all as it doesn't provide TTL options like Godox, Phottix, or Profoto but it is one more option for Sony and that's great. Apparently they're working on a Phase One RC-HS as well. Who knows... Maybe they'll do a Leica and Fuji as well.
I wonder if implementing FP-sync communication with the camera body is easier than all the rest of the TTL protocol requirements. That's all that has to happen for the "HotSync" to work.
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
I wonder if implementing FP-sync communication with the camera body is easier than all the rest of the TTL protocol requirements. That's all that has to happen for the "HotSync" to work.
I can't say for sure but there are those that focus on this technology like Pocket Wizard and Elinchrom. There are those that focus on TTL and HSS like Sony, Nissin, Godox, etc. There are those that do both like Phottix too.
 

dmward

Member
I can't say for sure but there are those that focus on this technology like Pocket Wizard and Elinchrom. There are those that focus on TTL and HSS like Sony, Nissin, Godox, etc. There are those that do both like Phottix too.
PW, Elinchrom, etc. are using the "Hyper Sync model because they are trying to elevate the older voltage controlled power management approach to FP-sync. Godox, and Phottix are the only ones, to date, using IGBT technology and high Hz pulsing that was introduced with speedlites. Profoto as well come to think of it.

The high Hz pulsing has more potential it seems because its a newer technology and also because, when using the lights at lower power, below X sync to do stop action.

Here's a video worth watching.
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
PW, Elinchrom, etc. are using the "Hyper Sync model because they are trying to elevate the older voltage controlled power management approach to FP-sync. Godox, and Phottix are the only ones, to date, using IGBT technology and high Hz pulsing that was introduced with speedlites. Profoto as well come to think of it.

The high Hz pulsing has more potential it seems because its a newer technology and also because, when using the lights at lower power, below X sync to do stop action.

Here's a video worth watching.
I believe that PCB uses IGBT in its Einstein line. In either case HSS nor TTL are available. Here's the press release in the Priolite Sony RC-HS controller. http://priolite.us/sony_hss
 

dmward

Member
I believe that PCB uses IGBT in its Einstein line. In either case HSS nor TTL are available. Introducing Priolite SONY HSS HotSync up to 1/8000th shutter speed
Yes. I had long and ultimately fruitless email discussions with him and PW engineering rep about adding FP high pulse burn to support higher shutter speeds. I was testing the MC2 with the ControlTL PWs.

PCB claimed it was not worth the effort to add TTL like features to the Einstein.

Another thing that would be interesting to know is the t.05 time as power is reduced below 1:1.
That's one of the things I learned when testing Hyper Sync with ControlTL. The lower the power setting with voltage power control, the longer the duration.

It looks like the HS lights have the batteries under the light body while the others have the battery in the body. That suggests that the space used by the battery has been taken up with capacitors.

I wonder if they tested with the camera flash menu settings other than wireless.
If you get some to test, see if they support second curtain sync which is exclusive of wireless.
The Godox X1 system suggests that SCS will work with Sony. That's one of the first things I want to test.
 
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iiiNelson

Well-known member
Yes. I had long and ultimately fruitless email discussions with him and PW engineering rep about adding FP high pulse burn to support higher shutter speeds. I was testing the MC2 with the ControlTL PWs.

PCB claimed it was not worth the effort to add TTL like features to the Einstein.

Another thing that would be interesting to know is the t.05 time as power is reduced below 1:1.
That's one of the things I learned when testing Hyper Sync with ControlTL. The lower the power setting with voltage power control, the longer the duration.

It looks like the HS lights have the batteries under the light body while the others have the battery in the body. That suggests that the space used by the battery has been taken up with capacitors.

I wonder if they tested with the camera flash menu settings other than wireless.
If you get some to test, see if they support second curtain sync which is exclusive of wireless.
The Godox X1 system suggests that SCS will work with Sony. That's one of the first things I want to test.
I emailed Priolite USA and asked on their Facebook page about the possibility to demo the lights. I believe that I read that it's possible to sync at all power levels from 9W/secs up to 1000W/secs. I think the the timing of the sync will adjust accordingly and it works with EFCS too although they recommend turning the option off above 1/1000 sec shutter speed. I will take a look further to see if I see anything on Second shutter sync.

i wholly agree on the PCB front too. I'd love native support and a more user friendly controller.
 

dmward

Member
Adorama shows the Sony variant Flashpoint (GoDox) TT685s available to order. I placed an order even though I have one coming from a reseller in China. Not sure which will arrive first. Would prefer to wait for the TT860s with lithium battery but also want to get these tested and into production as soon as possible.

One thing I noticed on the spec sheet is that they have a Canon external power plug. Not a problem if you once had Canon speedlites. Also the benefit of being able to use Paramount cables which I prefer to the Godox Sony cable. Longer and less stiff coiling.

More to come. :)

Update 12:29pm Got an update from Adorama saying the item is on backorder. Not sure it that means they sold out firs shipment from Godox or if they are just waiting for it to arrive. Now its a race to see if I get the one ordered from China first.

Helen Oster, a customer service ambassador at Adorma, while answering another question via email said that Adorama expects the X1 triggers and speedlites with Sony compatibility by end of April. That suggests the backorder status is for first batch.
 
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dmward

Member
For those planning to get one or more of the Godox X system devices that have upgradable firmware HERE is a page with the english translation.
The word document that downloads with the firmware is in Chinese. I did not bother to clean up the grammar since my American may be harder to understand than the Google translation.

If you are a Mac user, like me, you'll also have to come up with a Windows machine to run the firmware update software.
 

dmward

Member
Just got an email from my Godox sales contact in China that the Sony variant X1T is available. She is sending me two. Hopefully they will arrive within a couple of weeks. That suggests that they will start appearing at Adorama, Cheetah and others before too long.

I already have 3 XFR-16 and 3 XFR16s receivers to plug into my existing lights so testing can start as soon as they arrive.

The TT685IIs should be here any day.
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
Just got an email from my Godox sales contact in China that the Sony variant X1T is available. She is sending me two. Hopefully they will arrive within a couple of weeks. That suggests that they will start appearing at Adorama, Cheetah and others before too long.

I already have 3 XFR-16 and 3 XFR16s receivers to plug into my existing lights so testing can start as soon as they arrive.

The TT685IIs should be here any day.
Congrats. Are the CheetahStand versions TTL? I though I read that their TTL version wasn't being released until next year. I saw Adorama has the TTL versions being released as well.

What has been your experience with reliability with the Godox stuff?
 

dmward

Member
Congrats. Are the CheetahStand versions TTL? I though I read that their TTL version wasn't being released until next year. I saw Adorama has the TTL versions being released as well.

What has been your experience with reliability with the Godox stuff?
CheetahStand is not going to offer TTL version of the AD600. The AD360II is only TTL. For both lights the firmware, including TTL variants is updatable. Thus, a Canon TTL light can have Nikon and Sony TTL firmware added to it. The AD360 will also have interchangeable TTL hot foot plate so it can be converted from one to another. No specific word from Godox but I expect that they will be available as an accessory.

All the X1 system triggers are TTL capable and firmware updatable. The only physical difference as I understand it is that they have camera specific hot shoe and hot foot.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
So David I could buy there new portable with the transmitter on eBay right now actually than I can use same transmitter with Ad360 heads I currently have. Update firmware, update foot and they become TTL units or it just becomes compatible manual strobes using the same transmitters and receivers . They need a flow chart
 

dmward

Member
So David I could buy there new portable with the transmitter on eBay right now actually than I can use same transmitter with Ad360 heads I currently have. Update firmware, update foot and they become TTL units or it just becomes compatible manual strobes using the same transmitters and receivers . They need a flow chart
No firmware updates for the first generation lights that we all have now. The TTL firmware is for the second generation lights. The XTR-16 receiver replaces the FT-16 receiver that we are using now. The FT-16 is a 433Mhz system. The new X system is a 2.4Ghz system. With the X system transmitter its possible to control groups and channels from the transmitter. I think it will also control power setting on the older lights, that's one thing I'll confirm. The X system trigger/controller also supports FP sync on the Sony cameras with multifunction hotshoe so it makes it easy to do H mode with the older lights as well.

The Sony variant TT865s speedlite will also control up to three groups which can include the older lights using an XTR-16 receiver. There is a hotshoe on the X1 trigger so a speedlite can be mounted there for fill. One thing I will test is ability to use a Nissin Di700a in the hotshoe. I will also test placing the Nissin Air Commander in the X1 Trigger hotshoe to see if that works.

Any other test arrangements anyone can think of are welcome. I'm willing to do the testing, and don't want to overlook anything.
 

dmward

Member
Here is link to the Godox firmware update site: http://www.godox.com/EN/Download.html

The latest updates for the Godox AD360 and AD600 TTL units include compatibility with the just released X1Ts transmitter for Sony.

V2.6 for the AD360 includes X1T Sony compatibility
V2.2 for the AD600 includes X1T Sony compatibility
Both are dated 4-13-2016
 
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