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Thread: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

  1. #51
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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Quote Originally Posted by Lars Vinberg View Post
    Oh I would say it's even slower - and it's not single-shot so it's even less useful for subjects that are not stationary.

    Interesting to try if you don't have an LF rig though - and I think experimenting should be encouraged for those willing to make the effort.
    Very much agree! I spent about 3 hours experimenting with it last night actually, working out how many frames and what focal length I needed to give a 5X4 sensor real estate with the resolution of my 5D. Quick answer was use the same focal length you would use on a 5X4 but on the 35mm camera and stitch to cover the necessary FOV. In other words a 150mm lens to cover the 46 degree FOV provided by a 50mm lens on my DSLR. Ditto 90mm lens to cover the 65 degree FOV provided by a 28mm lens on a DSLR. Not actually a huge amount of frames, 25 will do it easily with room to spare.

    Most importantly, what is needed is the vision to make something like this work! I have to work on that aspect.
    Last edited by Ben Rubinstein; 1st September 2011 at 02:10.
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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Well, there is nothing to do but get started My first attempts were not so satisfactory, but I learned much from trying, and I am getting closer to what I want all the time. The tree with the red berries is what I have been trying to get. Now I need to get good enough to get that effect with other types of subjects too.
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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    If I may, I would like to keep this thread going - I just started trying this method myself and want to continue!

    My first bokeh panorama that I'm happy with:


    Nikon D90, 50/1.8 at f/4, four shots vertical.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Sorry to ask, as I'm eager to learn. What is the methodology behind this?

    Thanks
    Po

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    I'm sorry, I thought there was some sort of focus stacking involved to give the 'boke' effect. I recently did some HDR panoramics, and found it tricky in strong sunlight situations and moving people and trees swaying. Hence I wondered about the process/methodology to achieve a 'greater' boke effect in 35mm for pans.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Focus stacking is for when you have an extremely small depth of field (especially in macro applications) and want to extend the depth of field by shooting multiple images focussed at various points along the subject. Software is then used to get all the in-focus areas onto a single layered shot.

    In comparison, Boke(h) panoramas are panoramas in the sense of stitching images together to get a wider field of view than your lens at that focal length will give. The term boke(h) is used because the panoramas are done usually at a fast aperture, such that there are substantial out-of-focus regions (that is, there is a goodly amount of subject isolation).

    The methodology is pretty simple: multiple overlapping images (like a standard digital panorama) which are stitched together in software, with a shallow depth of field due to fast aperture or longer focal length. The result is a larger field of view where the depth of field is substantially smaller than would be expected at that equivalent focal length.

    Since large format cameras are very well known for this type of image, this methodology is a way of emulating the "look" of large format, using small format digital sensors.

    Hope that clears things up!

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Quote Originally Posted by Pierrard View Post
    Focus stacking is for when you have an extremely small depth of field (especially in macro applications) and want to extend the depth of field by shooting multiple images focussed at various points along the subject. Software is then used to get all the in-focus areas onto a single layered shot.

    In comparison, Boke(h) panoramas are panoramas in the sense of stitching images together to get a wider field of view than your lens at that focal length will give. The term boke(h) is used because the panoramas are done usually at a fast aperture, such that there are substantial out-of-focus regions (that is, there is a goodly amount of subject isolation).

    The methodology is pretty simple: multiple overlapping images (like a standard digital panorama) which are stitched together in software, with a shallow depth of field due to fast aperture or longer focal length. The result is a larger field of view where the depth of field is substantially smaller than would be expected at that equivalent focal length.

    Since large format cameras are very well known for this type of image, this methodology is a way of emulating the "look" of large format, using small format digital sensors.

    Hope that clears things up!
    Thank you Pierrard for your clear explanation.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Very quick and dirty test with an IQ180 and Mamiya 80mm f/1.9

    Poor stitch as I didn't set up the right XML for the sensor.



    Planning on a much bigger (multi-gigapixel) landscape shot sometime in the next couple of weeks using the Mamiya 300mm f/2.8 and will post here if people are interested.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    @gerald.d: that would be awesome! I do have to say the stitching errors in your initial test here are distracting, but a landscape shot (without the grief of parallax errors) would be very interesting, especially at that kind of focal length.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Yeah - as I said, this was just a really quick and dirty proof of concept. 20 minutes from start to finish. The set-up was fairly accurate for the nodal point of the lens - it's a stitch issue primarily, rather than parallax problems. I just wanted to get a feel for what the output would look like.

    I'll take rather more care over the landscape one

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Another test today.

    Obviously I need to sort out the vignetting on this, but I'm still very much operating in "proof of concept" mode.

    144 shots (24 columns by 6 rows) with the Mamiya 300mm f/2.8 on Phase One AF with IQ180. Full render is 5.7 gigapixels. Printed at 300 ppi, it would be 36 feet wide. You don't get anything like the full effect of this technique when you resize down to a small jpeg.

    Here's the full frame:



    Tree is around 60 feet away. Depth of field roughly 3 feet.

    A couple of crops from a 10% sized render so you can get a better handle on the true depth of field:



    This is what the stack of bricks to the right of the tree look like at the same size:



    Zoomable version (requires Flash):

    http://dxbae.com/panos/treepoc/build.html
    Last edited by gerald.d; 31st May 2012 at 14:06.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    If you figure out the vignetting problem, post it here! I've run into it once or twice myself, but not to that degree.

    BTW: how do you edit something of that size? Reduce the image to a fraction of its size, do layer adjustments, and resize?

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Vignetting largely (but not totally) sorted -

    Attachment 59519

    Full resolution image is being uploaded now. I'll link to it later.

    Happy with how this has turned out. Now all I need to do is find some decent subject matter

    (Not really any editing in this one - I wasn't aiming for a great image, just working through the mechanics of it all. My PC has 24GB of RAM and some fast scratch disks. The .psb file at full resolution is 34GB. Takes a while to load, but editable if desired.)

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Very interesting... I've always wanted to try out the Brenizer Method. I don't have a tele lens for the M9, so I used the 50'Lux ASPH instead shooting a closer subject. Also, I've cheated on the software side because I used the Microsoft ICE software (Microsoft Research Image Composite Editor (ICE)) to do the stitching for me:



    BTW, 16 images resulted in a final 64 megapixel image.
    Last edited by Hosermage; 1st June 2012 at 20:34.
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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Certainly not cheating to use software for the stitching. I use Kolor's Autopano Giga.

    No way would I try to stitch 144 x 80 megapixel files manually!
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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    @gerald.d: wow, the edited version does look much better! I wish I had your tech though - I'm running only 6GB RAM with Autopano Giga2, no scratch disk, and a 12MP DSLR. Can't wait to step up, but I am liking some of what comes out at least.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Faking 4x5. Three vertical stitches with 35mm PCNikkor shifted all the way up on a Kodak DCS.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Some pictures from last month in Central Park, Pana G1, Meyer-Optik 100mm Trioplan, f/2.8
    ________
    Manouch

    Stitch of 4 images


    Stitch of 2 images



    Stitch of 16 images, some cropping

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Here's a link to the full size version of the pano in my earlier post:

    Virtual Tour generated by Panotour

    (requires flash)

    I'm running off a test 2m x 5m print of this at the weekend as I still feel that this kind of image is best viewed in print form.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Tried this out to see what a large sensor with D7000/D800 pixels would look like, and to see what the fuss with larger formats was about (can you tell I'm a noob? )



    Shot with an 85mm 1.8. Full size is 120odd MP - effective sensor size around an iq180 stretched to 3:2, field of view is 32mm in 35 terms.

    Making sure the shots are done around the nodal point seems to make stitching much easier - I'm curious to try out later on to see if there's a way to do this so that dynamic scenes can be captured.

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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    Ran off a 5m x 2m print. Comes out very nicely.




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    Re: Boke Panoramas - large format with small cameras

    looks great gerald!

    I've really started liking this limited depth of field - a few nights ago I went down by a cemetery and noticed several deer wandering around the graves.

    These were shot with a $5 junk-drawer manual 300/5.6, around f/11 on a Nikon D90:

    9-images:


    13-images:


    20-images:


    Nothing close to the size of some of the panoramas on this thread, but hopefully they're of some interest.

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