Face Time - and macbook air

[jonoslack]

My other issue is lack of a firewire port

Ah . . . Now we're talking - I quite agree, it's really a pity that it's missing.

I have several places to work, and carrying machines around is really a bore, so all my documents folder (including my aperture library and this year's images and Windows virtual machines) are held on a small (2.5"), portable firewire 800 / USB 2 hard drive. Which is fine, but the firewire 800 is so much better.

This isn't perfect, but the drive is TrueCrypt encrypted, so when I leave it on a plane, or get my car stolen, then I don't have to explain to clients where their confidential data has gone.

Still, I don't have your problem with the tethering, so I can deal with USB2 (with regret).

Basically I have a Mac Pro in the office, together with a 17"MBP (8gb SSD) which i use for most work, and which I take on site for long trips.

At home I have an i5 27" imac, which works well. . . . .

But when I go on personal trips I still have to be capable of doing work, and that's where an MBA would come in. Currently I use a maxxed out 13"MBP, but I relish losing 3lb, and having better screen resolution.

But I stick to my point - apart from the sad lack of a FW800 drive, which, I can see is a real problem for you, I don't think the price / performance ratio is against the MBA, and the benchmarks do seem to bear that out.

I really wanted an 11", but the SSD port on the 13" effectively frees one of the two USB ports for ethernet, the 256Gb SSD allows enough space for all the images from a trip, and the extra screen resolution add up to a much more attractive package (and it only weighs an extra pound).

 

[LJL]

Not to put too much of twist into this, but the flash storage on the MBA is not really the same as an SSD, from what has been reported in several places. So yes, it will still be better than a HDD, but it is not performing quite as well as an SSD. Not sure why, but that was something that did catch my attention when I was looking at these upon first release.

Have to say, a tricked out 13" MBA could go a long way for decent notebook use, aside from the tethering issue due to lack of FW800. Tethering or not, the lack of FW800 has been a hurdle for me to get more comfortable thinking about the MBA. I know my 15" i7 MBP will run circles around the MBA, but it is also double the weight, and at times, that matters a lot.

Jono, in your case, I hear the siren of the MBA calling your name ;-) Seems like it would work nicely into your kit of options.

LJ

 

[jonoslack]

Not to put too much of twist into this, but the flash storage on the MBA is not really the same as an SSD, from what has been reported in several places. So yes, it will still be better than a HDD, but it is not performing quite as well as an SSD. Not sure why, but that was something that did catch my attention when I was looking at these upon first release.

Have to say, a tricked out 13" MBA could go a long way for decent notebook use, aside from the tethering issue due to lack of FW800. Tethering or not, the lack of FW800 has been a hurdle for me to get more comfortable thinking about the MBA. I know my 15" i7 MBP will run circles around the MBA, but it is also double the weight, and at times, that matters a lot.

Jono, in your case, I hear the siren of the MBA calling your name ;-) Seems like it would work nicely into your kit of options.

LJ

Yes - well that's three of us who would really have liked FW800 - but as I say, the SD card slot helps.

I'm definitely tempted - especially as my wife's old black MB is getting rather tired (she has her eyes on the 13"MBP).

I didn't know about the SSD / Flash difference, but I do believe you. I spent half an hour playing with an 11" 2Gb / 64 Gb in the Norwich Apple Store on Friday - it seemed very snappy loading the general suspects and getting about, certainly a different world from the old Air.

 

[Godfrey]

Not to put too much of twist into this, but the flash storage on the MBA is not really the same as an SSD, from what has been reported in several places. So yes, it will still be better than a HDD, but it is not performing quite as well as an SSD. Not sure why, but that was something that did catch my attention when I was looking at these upon first release.

Apple's got a lot of experience with flash memory storage systems ... look at how many bazillion iPhones, iPods, iPads they've sold. What they do on these small devices is organize and integrate the storage chipset into the logic board rather than build it into its own enclosure and put that on the logic board. The result is better use of space and better heat dissipation.

What metric are you referring to when you say, "it will still be better than a HDD, but it is not performing quite as well as an SSD"? By my casual test of a new MBA against an SSD MBP at the store, I was impressed that the MBA seemed to perform better than the higher-spec'ed MBP, particularly with respect to application launch times.

 

[LJL]

Well, since I need to provide a metric against your "casual test", try this: http://www.barefeats.com/mbpp27.html (please read the Addendum at the end for the metrics)

Did you test the MBA against a the higher spec'ed MBP with an SSD in the MBP?

LJ

P.S. Oops, you did say the MBP has an SSD....sorry. But was it an Apple SSD (not among the speedier ones out there), or a faster 3rd party drive? Not all SSD units are the same.

 

[cam]

um... excuse me for interrupting the cat fight going on , but can i ask a question about reliability and longevity of the SSD (or whatever it is in the newer MBAs?

we had one regular drive just die from my 17" (i abuse it frequently with multi-layer PS documents) and another from the original MBA in the house... the 17" makes sense -- it was old, used and abused -- but the MBA is not that old and wasn't used that much either... that, if anything, gives me pause on the newer ones as you can't change out the drives yourself.

thank you (and sorry to interrupt).

 

[LJL]

No "cat fight" here....just trying to keep a perspective ;-)

You are asking about an unknown right now.....the longer term performance of the flash memory in the new MBAs. With SSDs that are using Sandforce technologies, they build in some redundancy in storage to swap out sectors as they start to fail. No idea how Apple is handling that with their new flash storage, and evidently not too much information out there yet either. But being able to swap a drive if something goes bad is attractive to some users, but not a feature these new notebooks have any longer. Same with the battery. If it goes south, back to Apple to fix/replace. Personally, most of this stuff looks to be sort of designed for the average user (not "abuser"), with replacement plans every couple years or so. Just my opinion. Not saying it is not a good move by Apple for design, sales, upgrade path, etc., but it may not accommodate the folks on the edge of the performance distribution curves that need to replace things more often from heavier use/abuse as you put it.

LJ

 

[jonoslack]

um... excuse me for interrupting the cat fight going on , but can i ask a question about reliability and longevity of the SSD (or whatever it is in the newer MBAs?

we had one regular drive just die from my 17" (i abuse it frequently with multi-layer PS documents) and another from the original MBA in the house... the 17" makes sense -- it was old, used and abused -- but the MBA is not that old and wasn't used that much either... that, if anything, gives me pause on the newer ones as you can't change out the drives yourself.

thank you (and sorry to interrupt).

:ROTFL:
It should be more reliable than a hard drive.

why don't you replace the 17" drive? it really isn't that much of a mission, and maybe it solves your problem?

 

[cam]

thanks, LJ, that helps.

then that puts me probably back into the 11" (if i can afford the luxury) for travel and an iMac (or one of the newer MBPs in january) with an external screen for my main work station.

in the meanwhile, i'll try to get this damned "mouse" fixed before i go on my next trip and see if everything still plays nice with the occasional tweak on the road... i still do find the Air more attractive than the iPad (my own personal preference), especially as i refuse to lug the 17" on another trip.

 

[cam]

:ROTFL:
It should be more reliable than a hard drive.

why don't you replace the 17" drive? it really isn't that much of a mission, and maybe it solves your problem?

Kevin did -- it's done! (canabalised from another sitting around)

i'm thinking about the future, sir, and i'm just skittish now... after his MBA drive failed as well, it made me think...

 

[Godfrey]

Well, since I need to provide a metric against your "casual test", try this: http://www.barefeats.com/mbpp27.html (please read the Addendum at the end for the metrics)

Did you test the MBA against a the higher spec'ed MBP with an SSD in the MBP?

LJ

P.S. Oops, you did say the MBP has an SSD....sorry. But was it an Apple SSD (not among the speedier ones out there), or a faster 3rd party drive? Not all SSD units are the same.

Not sure why you want to make it seem like my "casual test" should be something definitive. I asked a simple question about what metrics you are using. I see you are not actually testing the unit yourself, just referring to someone else's tests. Ok.

I was looking at both computers at an Apple Store. I doubt the MBP with SSD in it would have anything but an Apple drive.

I read the review you linked to. It sounds like a fair test, Apple's solid state storage integrated with all other factors performs well, if not at the bleeding edge for standalone devices of this sort.

The final statement is what matters:

"... But fantasies aside, the MacBook Air 2010 is not an iPad with a keyboard. It's not a high powered pro laptop. It is a light, thin, beautifully designed ultraportable fully capable of light to medium tasks. ... "

That's exactly what I'm looking for. ;-)

 

[Godfrey]

Kevin did -- it's done! (canabalised from another sitting around)

i'm thinking about the future, sir, and i'm just skittish now... after his MBA drive failed as well, it made me think...

A good backup policy is the only thing that actually reduces the risks of drive failure and provides data security.

 

[jonoslack]

A good backup policy is the only thing that actually reduces the risks of drive failure

Godfrey! I never had you down as a believer in Murphy's law!
Quite agree about the backup policy though.

 

[cam]

i did and do back up, redundantly in fact, but some of my newer processing was lost, along with a set of JFI Lab converters in C1... i did a clean install of everything else (can't calibrate my monitor any more, though, now that i've been upgraded to Snow Leopard) and was even gifted a free upgrade on an action set i own who's installer no longer worked.

after losing three months of photos back in 2007 due to hard drive failure on a brand new drive, my images are backed up and backed up -- i learned my lesson. did i say i back up? never got those images back, as the cost was too extreme... still have the drive, though. maybe someday.

 

[Godfrey]

Godfrey! I never had you down as a believer in Murphy's law!...

Can't imagine why not. I always work with the assumption that things can go wrong at any moment. I'm pleasantly surprised when they don't.

 

[Godfrey]

i did and do back up, redundantly in fact, but some of my newer processing was lost, along with a set of JFI Lab converters in C1... i did a clean install of everything else (can't calibrate my monitor any more, though, now that i've been upgraded to Snow Leopard) and was even gifted a free upgrade on an action set i own who's installer no longer worked.

after losing three months of photos back in 2007 due to hard drive failure on a brand new drive, my images are backed up and backed up -- i learned my lesson. did i say i back up? never got those images back, as the cost was too extreme... still have the drive, though. maybe someday.

Hmm. Sounds like your backup policy isn't stringent enough.

I run the backup every time I move data from card to computer, before erasing the cards. I've had two drives go belly-up ... one startup, one data ... in the past five years but my only losses have been about an hour of editing time.

Why can't you calibrate your monitor running Snow Leopard? (I use an Eye One Display 2, the software was updated last March and is fully compatible with Snow Leopard.)

 

[cam]

probably not stringent enough, but my most important stuff is and was and always will be. cards are duplicated immediately before erasing... it was the little things i didn't do -- but that has changed. live and learn.

as for calibration, i have an older Eye One (and, yes, the newest software was installed). i can calibrate colour but not luminance and, since most of my pics are b/w, that's really important to me. i don' know if the fact that i have an older 17" is also a factor... it's driving me a bit mad right now.

 

[Godfrey]

... as for calibration, i have an older Eye One (and, yes, the newest software was installed). i can calibrate colour but not luminance and, since most of my pics are b/w, that's really important to me. i don' know if the fact that i have an older 17" is also a factor... it's driving me a bit mad right now.

Hmm. Why can't you calibrate luminance? I don't understand... Isn't there a brightness control on your 17"? It's been on every MacBook I've seen, triggered by tapping two keys on the keyboard.

 

[cam]

it stays way below the recommended "90" mark, even if i bump it up to full.

(seems pretty dark to me as well, though i've sent images to friends that i thought were too dark and they told me they were fine... i gave up but may try to tackle it again tomorrow. i'm probably being an idiot, but i hate relying on C1 or CS3 to give me correct exposure... sigh.)

btw, thank you for pushing me to get the 25/1.4 for my E1 -- even if it has been kidnapped, lovingly, by my other... it *is* a luscious lens!

 

[Amin]

I used one in the store and liked it a lot, especially the 11" model. My brother picked one up and loves it: http://bijansabet.com/post/1423512796/quick-review-macbook-air-11#disqus_thread

My only criticism is the battery life. If a sub-$400 Eee-PC can have a 10-hour battery life, then there's little excuse for Apple to put a 5-hour battery in the 11" Air. Apple set the battery life standard high with the iPad, and I think they need to step up with the Air battery life, even if it means making it slightly less airy.

Facetime for Mac brings up another Apple pet peeve of mine. They drop support for old OSX versions too fast. Facetime requires 10.6.4. One of my Macs is happily running 10.5.8, and I find it hard to believe that they couldn't create a Facetime app with a little backwards compatibility.