leica s lenses af motor failures

[atanabe]

I thought it was the gear on the motor that failed not the motors. Having said that the entire assembly probably is what is replaced.

It would be good customer service for Leica to ALSO offer S owners a $100 Visa prepaid card to make them feel like Leica cares about their S customers AND also make the repairs free on all lenses from 5 years from when they announced a resolution or say from 1/1/17 for 5 years forward.

Could be too much to ask for a company that likes your money, but not your complaints.

Yes, it is the gear that strips which is attached to the motor requiring the entire part to be replaced.

Great sense of humor on the second paragraph! It is just the opposite, "pay for our mistake in engineering". What is next? Pay for a corroded sensor?

 

[msadat]

on this one, i have to give it to leica. there was a problem (during which if you encountered it, it was fixed without charge). they found a solution and now they are telling every one. give them a break. yes when thing break; it is usually inopportune time and we all have been there. i have had these kind of issues with canon with the 1d iii body, the nikon 300mm f4 vr, canon 5d iii,...... everything is buggy these days.

 

[DB5]

After everything S customers have been through with this system you would think and hope Leica would do the right thing to those loyal enough to stick around. 5 year cut off to fix their costly and inconvenient, bordering on terrifying (for some) mistake and time bomb on very premium gear is terrible and astonishing. Leica have some serious work to do to win any sort trust back from existing customers and potentials alike and then they go and do something like this? So much for the new "business unit" and taking care of the pro. I would not dream, in a million years, of treating my customers in this way, it would finish me. With their track record and this response, why on earth would I ever buy another Leica?

:facesmack:

 

[glenerrolrd]

on this one, i have to give it to leica. there was a problem (during which if you encountered it, it was fixed without charge). they found a solution and now they are telling every one. give them a break. yes when thing break; it is usually inopportune time and we all have been there. i have had these kind of issues with canon with the 1d iii body, the nikon 300mm f4 vr, canon 5d iii,...... everything is buggy these days.

OK lets review some personal facts ..so that you might see a DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE.

1. Purchased the S2,S006 and S007 ..still have the 006/007 combination . Been an S user since it was introduced . S2 sensor failed twice . The first time Leica asked me to pay $7K claiming I damaged it thru cleaning ...but no one had ever cleaned the sensor . Eventually the marketing department paid for the repair ..service would never agree . Subsequently the sensor corrosion issue was admitted .

2. Have purchased all the Leica S lenses except the Tilt/Shift . Upgraded two to CS versions .

3. Lens Failures ... all when mounted on the S 007 (none prior) . Five out of the nine failed when mounted for the first time . (JAN 17). (When I traded my defective S2 for an S 007).

4. Have been sending lenses to Wetzler directly thru my dealer 5 have the new AF module .

5. Two are in Wetzler and two more will be sent .

6. Have a half dozen friends that have Leica S and all have had multiple lens failures .

7. Leica has been fixing the AF module (without concerns about in or out of warranty for more than a year ).

8. Research LUF and you can find posts that show the AF module and exactly why it fails (this has been confirmed thru multiple sources inside Leica ).

9. Leica acknowledges the issue months after it has been common knowledge to ALL S owners .

10. Leica S used values have fallen to between 30-50% of original purchase price . Making taking out of the system financially unreasonable for many . (Most common complaint of my friends ).

Why do I care ?

The S system is my favorite system (outside of the M) . It is capable of producing superb IQ and as a system still has lenses that are the envy of all the MF world . Weather proofed,built like a tank ,OVF ..hits all my requirements .

LEICA s SELF SERVIVING POLICY IS CLEARLY AN ATTEMPT TO PUT A CAP ON THE REPAIR COSTS. It is customer unfriendly and will further damage its reputation .

 

[MGrayson]

Leica S prices have dropped because of the MP wars. What does a 40MP Hassy go for these days? Hassy and Phase/Schneider lenses keep their value because there are higher MP systems on which to use them. Let Leica come out with a >60MP S and you'll see a quick revival of used S lens prices.

But what do I know? I've never had any problems with any Leica equipment (a few cracked lens hoods, repaired with gaffer tape), but then only a few 10's of thousands of frames, so I'm hardly a power user.

--Matt

 

[glenerrolrd]

Agree 100% that a new S with higher MP is required to recharge demand . But major damage has been done to both Leica and the S system reputations . And the latest Policy Statement is so self serving to be insulting .

 

[msadat]

Roger, some of your points are well taken, but this is a business and they need to manage risk. look the auto companies, they are always in denial, on the camera market, it took a government (china) to push nikon to fix the d600 sensor problem.

prices have fallen on s because thats the nature of digital and it will be like this. the hasselblad h4-40 or going for 4k so why not leica.

medium format and auto focus for leica was brand new both at the same time. the company needed to get modernized and roll out products at the same time. stumbled they did , but i think they are back up.

what i don't understand, is sticking to low mp for all the cameras. they are exactly one generation behind, aps or now 24, full frame 30+ medium format 50 +


i too have a full set leica s lenses and did take advantage of the low prices to double up on some and also got a second 007. at the end this the price of using this system nothing more.


big question for me is what they do now, there is shift in the market to mirrorless and smaller bodies that technology has made available, what does leica do with S

 

[atanabe]

Roger, some of your points are well taken, but this is a business and they need to manage risk. look the auto companies, they are always in denial, on the camera market, it took a government (china) to push nikon to fix the d600 sensor problem.

prices have fallen on s because thats the nature of digital and it will be like this. the hasselblad h4-40 or going for 4k so why not leica.

medium format and auto focus for leica was brand new both at the same time. the company needed to get modernized and roll out products at the same time. stumbled they did , but i think they are back up.

what i don't understand, is sticking to low mp for all the cameras. they are exactly one generation behind, aps or now 24, full frame 30+ medium format 50 +


i too have a full set leica s lenses and did take advantage of the low prices to double up on some and also got a second 007. at the end this the price of using this system nothing more.


big question for me is what they do now, there is shift in the market to mirrorless and smaller bodies that technology has made available, what does leica do with S

I agree the nature of digital is newer, better, faster, which has affected the price of the S gear as all digital platforms. What the main point in most of the threads is the lack of responsibility that Leica has taken on the AF failure, that has only accelerated the drop in prices. A year of internet banter about how long the fix takes to complete made second hand lenses toxic on the used market. Now there is a fix in place with a defined period in which lenses can be fixed for free which excludes pretty much all of the first adopters. There is no telling when the AF motor will fail but you can pay $400 to have it replaced, is not the way to support all the early adopters. It should be an advisory recall of lenses with XXXX serial number based on production date outside of the 5 years at a discounted rate not $400.

This may put a halt to the slide in prices of S lenses but in reality, the Hasselblad MF lenses usually sell for 40-60% of their retail on the used market. Which is about what the S lenses are going for today. What differentiates the two is that Hasselblad lenses can be used on many other platforms where the S is limited to one. I really hope they do decide to support the S system with a newer platform one that can compete in the current marketplace and beyond.

 

[fotografz]

Photographers complaining about this AF issue aren't doing so because they do not LOVE their S system and Leica products ... but because they are being treated like they don't!

Many, if not most, have had a long relationship with the company through thick and thin, and have demonstrated a loyalty that others may deem obsessive given some of the "difficulties" they have experienced yet stuck with Leica.

Remember, it was with great fan-fare Leica surprised the photographic world with the S MFD offering ... positioning it as a professional system of a unique and exquisite design, robust performance, and of course all new Leica lenses designed and built from the ground up ... then touted as world class.

While it is easy to cherry pick issues from other companies and use them in the aggregate to imply it happens all the time, I seriously doubt so many users have experienced a collection of issues with one camera model and every focal length of its highly dedicated lens system the likes of this. In 45 years of shooting I sure haven't. Keeping in mind that my other systems faced far more rigorous duty than this one ever has.

Through most of the S trials and tribulations, I've given Leica the benefit of the doubt.

S2P cracked sensor, fading top LCD, failed shutter button, extremely slow roll out of the leaf-shutter CS lens versions, multiple failed AF and a lost lens, failed central shutter, failed battery, failed battery charger, potential S(006) sensor corrosion, slow tether up-dates , etc., etc. Something from this kit has been gone to Germany for months almost 15 times!

Yet, I soldiered on with them ... despite the inconvenience, I will acknowledge they backed their product ... and people like John Kreidler and Roxana Lynch of Leica have been most helpful ... a special callout of Tony Rose of POPFLASH for his intervention on a few critical issues recently:thumbup:

However, this announcement is very disappointing. I honestly do not expect some eternal warranty ... just the system I paid dearly for ... to all work for a few years.

I've no idea whether recent lens repairs ... or the new 70mm they sent me for the one they lost ... feature the new AF part or not. Zero communication. I do not know if 5 years starts after an older repair was done, or from the original purchase date ... I assume the latter.:thumbdown:

I do not want anything else, or a different system ... just my S(006) and 6 lenses I can trust ... without being extorted out even more very hard earned money, and the lost of the lenses for months and months. Plus, I face the inevitability of sensor corrosion with the (006), and hope a statement like this one isn't issued before that happens.

Sigh,

- Marc

 

[Yevgeny NP]

Does anyone know how I can find out when a second hand lens was sold originally?

The Leica announcement means that it's customer's duty to know when the lens was sold for the first time. Some S lenses are sold in Hong Kong with very unconvincing or incomplete documents but the prices are tempting.

Or maybe I am asking a stupid question again?

 

[kinok1]

I'm not particularly active on this forum. But I was a long time S user. Starting with the S2 all the way through the 007. I owned 4 lenses, all of which had AF fail. Some were fixed quickly, some took months. My 007 body bricked after owning it for less than a week and spent 4 mos in Germany getting fixed. There was no communication.

I'm glad to see Leica making good on fixing all of these lenses. They had to. But I'll be bitingly honest...I recently dumped all of my S gear, and after trading in my digital M bodies..i'm done with anything Leica digital. There are too many other camera companies out there all with brilliant lenses to deal with the service that Leica provides (or cant provide).

 

[algrove]

on this one, i have to give it to leica. there was a problem (during which if you encountered it, it was fixed without charge). they found a solution and now they are telling every one. give them a break. yes when thing break; it is usually inopportune time and we all have been there. i have had these kind of issues with canon with the 1d iii body, the nikon 300mm f4 vr, canon 5d iii,...... everything is buggy these days.

Not everything is buggy, it just seems most everything digital that Leica makes is buggy.

Whenever something does go wrong, it is how that company handles it that counts and keeps me coming back.

I recall after trip directly to Leica CS in Germany from the US, two "experts" lied to me about my M240 problems I was encountering only to find out a year later through Roxanne at NJ CS that I was correct a year earlier.

I knew then that my Leica days were numbered and I began selling 30 R lenses and 65 M lenses. So glad I never got into the S system.

Bought into Phase with the 45+ and now the XF +100 and that company gets it on all counts.

 

[algrove]

I'm not particularly active on this forum. But I was a long time S user. Starting with the S2 all the way through the 007. I owned 4 lenses, all of which had AF fail. Some were fixed quickly, some took months. My 007 body bricked after owning it for less than a week and spent 4 mos in Germany getting fixed. There was no communication.

I'm glad to see Leica making good on fixing all of these lenses. They had to. But I'll be bitingly honest...I recently dumped all of my S gear, and after trading in my digital M bodies..i'm done with anything Leica digital. There are too many other camera companies out there all with brilliant lenses to deal with the service that Leica provides (or cant provide).

Yes, those in the Leica coccoon just will never believe that other lenses can be as good if not better than a Leica S lenses, not to mention the S camera. I understand once you are all in with an expensive system like the S, it's very difficult to sell and go for something else which can be better, expecially with the lower prices which have affected just about all Leica lenses since they increased volume perhaps beyond demand.

 

[erlingmm]

Not everything is buggy, it just seems most everything digital that Leica makes is buggy.

Whenever something does go wrong, it is how that company handles it that counts and keeps me coming back.

I recall after trip directly to Leica CS in Germany from the US, two "experts" lied to me about my M240 problems I was encountering only to find out a year later through Roxanne at NJ CS that I was correct a year earlier.

I knew then that my Leica days were numbered and I began selling 30 R lenses and 65 M lenses. So glad I never got into the S system.

Bought into Phase with the 45+ and now the XF +100 and that company gets it on all counts.

So, 30 R lenses and 65 M lenses were enough to pay for the XF+100 ? Then I understand, much easier to carry.

Cocoon? No, just a happy S user.

 

[glenerrolrd]

Yes, those in the Leica coccoon just will never believe that other lenses can be as good if not better than a Leica S lenses, not to mention the S camera.

Thats because other camera systems lenses ARE NOT AS GOOD AS THE LEICA S lenses ....when compared as system. Of course some lenses individually most certainly are AS GOOD .....but no manufacturer has a complete set . The Leica S lenses ..every one of them are superb optics . (With the exception of the AF module ) . Built like tanks ,weather proof . Most important to me is that they create a cohesive aesthetic ...the files work well together . Color matching is easy . In addition they are of a reasonable size given the coverage required for the S .

HB s HC lenses and Phase Blue Ring Schneider lenses are both strong competitors ....but are larger ,heavier and require much larger DSLR bodies .. e.g. lenses maybe great but I am not using an XF or H6D body . The new Fuji and HB X1D are the real competitors AND THEY DON T HAVE A COMPETITIVE SET OF LENSES . So maybe in the future one or both of these systems will be viewed as JUST AS GOOD AS A LEICA ....but I doubt it .

I realize we can t put aside the AF fiasco ....my S cameras have been about average for maintenance and repair . Not always but having used the S system for 7 years ...I am still quite happy with it . :clap:

 

[algrove]

Now I'm getting some responses that the S ystem deserves from its long term owners.:grin:

 

[algrove]

So, 30 R lenses and 65 M lenses were enough to pay for the XF+100 ? Then I understand, much easier to carry.

Cocoon? No, just a happy S user.

Much better results. I also shed the 4 M digital bodies too. Anyone want some EVF-2's? The only lenses I regretted selling were the APO 50's.

 

[docmoore]

Anyone want some EVF-2's? The only lenses I regretted selling were the APO 50's.

PM

Bob