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Thread: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

  1. #1
    Mitch Alland
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    Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    I thought some people might be interested with my initial struggles to do street photography with the Nikon D300 compared to the GRD2, but it still too early for any conclusions:

    http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/showth...6992#post16992

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

  2. #2
    Senior Member nostatic's Avatar
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    tough crowd there.

    Do you find that being an in Nambia you can use the dslr as a "tourist" and get shots easily? I know that when I was in Hong Kong it seemed easier to snap away with a bigger camera than it is here in LA.

    wrt DOF, that is a challenge. I've been shooting a lot with my Pentax lately and end up going auto ISO setting the range from 100 to 1600, and stopping down to get some extra breathing room. One advantage I get back is that I can run a Pentax 50-135* f2.8 zoom that has incredible contrast and shoot from further away. With the larger sensor I can crop and still get a decent image. Not quite "street" though.

    The good news is that your D300 should have stunning AF performance (the Pentax is weak in that area). You should be able to frame/af/snap quickly. For street on the Pentax I always use single point AF and center what I'm shooting at, then swing to frame while the shutter is halfway down. The multipoint often gets confused in busy environments. I also have a 1 second review so I can check exposure as the metering can be interesting as well. I end up switching between spot and average depending. Luckily on the Pentax it is an old school lever as opposed to a menu option.

    I look forward to your experiments, especially what you do with the "clean" files (relative to small sensor). I'm seeing a significant difference between 10mp small sensor and 14.6mp aps.
    Last edited by nostatic; 27th March 2008 at 00:19.

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    Senior Member otumay's Avatar
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Funny you've raised the issue just when I traded my D2x for a D300, and was contemplating a comparison of these two cameras myself. A few weeks back, I made a similar comparison between the GRD-2 and Kodak DCS Pro SLR/n and reached somewhat striking (immature perhaps?) results: Ricoh failed miserably in white balance (I was shooting RAW), and to add insult to injury, gone were the details of buildings I've shot from a couple of hundred meters. Kodak, itself not a good performer in the white balance category, excelled when compared to the Ricoh.
    Last weekend me and my girlfriend went to some rural parts of Turkey with my new D300. She used the GRD-2 (Fine jpeg, b+w) and we nearly always ended up with similar shots. I liked her photos a lot, though I'm also much impressed with my output with the D300. A dynamic range almost comparable to Fujifilm S5 Pro, an attractive soft look without compromising resolution and detail, and lovely colours I've come to expect only from Sigma SD-14. A comparison would be unjust however, since I shot RAW only. Anyway, to sum up, I have a feeling that GRD-2 is best when shooting b+w at close range.
    Will keep in touch if something creeps up. By the way, I liked your shots very much.

  4. #4
    Mitch Alland
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Quote Originally Posted by nostatic View Post
    tough crowd there.
    Telling me! Don't people realize that you have to learn to use a camera? There is also the issue that the GRD2 may turn out to be much more suitable for street photography than the D300, although I have not concluded that yet because I don't know the new camera well enough yet.

    Do you find that being an in Nambia you can use the dslr as a "tourist" and get shots easily? I know that when I was in Hong Kong it seemed easier to snap away with a bigger camera than it is here in LA.
    Don't know yet as I've only been able to shoot yesterday in Tsumeb, a mining town where there are no tourists.

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

  5. #5
    Mitch Alland
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Quote Originally Posted by otumay View Post
    Funny you've raised the issue just when I traded my D2x for a D300, and was contemplating a comparison of these two cameras myself. A few weeks back, I made a similar comparison between the GRD-2 and Kodak DCS Pro SLR/n and reached somewhat striking (immature perhaps?) results: Ricoh failed miserably in white balance (I was shooting RAW), and to add insult to injury, gone were the details of buildings I've shot from a couple of hundred meters. Kodak, itself not a good performer in the white balance category, excelled when compared to the Ricoh.
    Last weekend me and my girlfriend went to some rural parts of Turkey with my new D300. She used the GRD-2 (Fine jpeg, b+w) and we nearly always ended up with similar shots. I liked her photos a lot, though I'm also much impressed with my output with the D300. A dynamic range almost comparable to Fujifilm S5 Pro, an attractive soft look without compromising resolution and detail, and lovely colours I've come to expect only from Sigma SD-14. A comparison would be unjust however, since I shot RAW only. Anyway, to sum up, I have a feeling that GRD-2 is best when shooting b+w at close range.
    Will keep in touch if something creeps up. By the way, I liked your shots very much.
    Thanks, Otumay! Although I haven't run any tests it's easy to see that the D300 has more dynamic range than the GRD2, with less of a tendency to blow highlights. Indeed, the colours of the RAW files are very good.

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

  6. #6
    Senior Member ecliffordsmith's Avatar
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Hi Mitch,

    Tough indeed. Out of curiosity, what made you go for D300 or DSLR in general?

    I am curious how you find peoples reactions change. I find a difference between my M8 and a GRD2.

  7. #7
    Mitch Alland
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Ed, last week I found that I was going able to take off some ten days in Namibia and therefore wanted a camera that could take a telephoto with an EFOV of 300mm for photographing game. Then, when I looked at the D300 in a Bangkok camera store I found the technology dazzling, particularly the incredibly fast and accurate autofocus, together with the relatively quiet shutter and the quick, well-dampened mirror movement. Also, I wanted to see how, and whether, my photography would change with high-quality larger sensor camera. Finally, I also wanted to try a camera that would be much easier to work with at ISO 1600 and 3200.

    As I only shot yesterday evening I cannot yet conclude on whether people react differently to this larger camera the to the GRD2, but to go by these initials impressions of yesterday alone my feeling is that it is not than different.

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

  8. #8
    ellemand
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Hey Mitch.

    I've added some pictures to my flickr-site.
    They are all taken with Canon DSLR and there are a lot of street-photos - take a look and let me know, what you think;-)

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/elleman...7604271516605/

    Cheers
    Ellemand.

  9. #9
    Mitch Alland
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Ellemand, here in Namibia the ISP connection that I'm using is slow. Therefore, I was able to look at only one of the pictures, the one of the two men running in the rain, which I sort of like. How do you feel about doing this kind of street photography with a DSLR rather than a small sensor camera?

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

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    the first thing that strikes me...

    the broad dynamic range of the D300 images...most of what I have seen here from the grd2/gx100 cameras are severly clipped whites and blacks...not that they don't look good, just a fact, to each his/her own about liking that or not...

    not sure if 'dynamic range' is the right term here but these D300 images look more three dimensional, broader steps from lights to darks...

    in my own work i much prefer the dslr quality/range to my F30, but I always attract a lot of attention with the 'big black box'...people wave me off not to take their picture...i never get that with the F30...'big black box' = pro/uncomfortable...F30 = tourist/harmless...

    as for the nasty remarks about your work getting stale etc...blow it off, do your thing...it's blablabla...

    thanks for sharing your work and work method with us mitch...i've seen your work and read your ideas first on the dpr forums...then found you here...

    myself, i'm toying with the idea of a gx100 or grd2 but hesitate...i actually prefer the gx100 for the zoom lens but think i may wait a bit, see if ricoh introduces an upgraded version with more internal memory so shooting raw isn't so tedious...

    i've also been hesitant because of the narrower, in my eyes, 'dynamic range'...but compromise is what these little wonders are all about...at least in 2008...one day we will have D300 image quality in the size of a grd2...when?...anybodys guess...



    Quote Originally Posted by Mitch Alland View Post
    I thought some people might be interested with my initial struggles to do street photography with the Nikon D300 compared to the GRD2, but it still too early for any conclusions:

    http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/showth...6992#post16992

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

  11. #11
    ellemand
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Hey Mitch.
    I have no problem using DSLR's to my street-photography - and I do that a lot.
    I use my GRD's and D-lux3 for that too, when I often don't wont to carry the big camera.
    When I go out shooting with the DSLR I often use only one prime - mostly 35 mm (equalized) or an 17-40 mm zoom.

    Cheers
    Ellemand.
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/ellemand/

  12. #12
    Mitch Alland
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    Re: the first thing that strikes me...

    Quote Originally Posted by momo View Post
    as for the nasty remarks about your work getting stale etc...blow it off, do your thing...it's blablabla...
    No, that doesn't bother me — it takes all kinds...
    Quote Originally Posted by momo View Post
    ...myself, i'm toying with the idea of a gx100 or grd2 but hesitate...i actually prefer the gx100 for the zoom lens but think i may wait a bit, see if ricoh introduces an upgraded version with more internal memory so shooting raw isn't so tedious...
    You may want to consider the GRD2 with the 21mm and 40mm EFOV converters, which I like a lot. I've shot some interesting portraits with the latter that you may have seen. Waiting is problematic with digital because everything changes so fast — for the same reason buying is problematic as well.

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

  13. #13
    Subscriber Member mwalker's Avatar
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Mitch, I really like the waiter shot in this series and all of your work. I've been studing your work closley with the GDRII. Do you find the GRDII a little edgier and the D300 photos more refined?
    Mike

    website under construction

  14. #14
    Mitch Alland
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Thanks, Mike. It's really too soon to tell after only one evening's shooting with the D300.

    —Mith/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    David and Goliath
    Thats what I thought when I read the title of this thread
    Seriously, Mitch I do NOT find your work to be stale and it is NOT your *duty* to knock anyones socks off but your own.
    That being said, change is good; it refreshes ones view of the world and helps one to grow.
    I shall watch your synergy with the Nikon with interest.

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    Re: the first thing that strikes me...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mitch Alland View Post
    No, that doesn't bother me — it takes all kinds...You may want to consider the GRD2 with the 21mm and 40mm EFOV converters, which I like a lot. I've shot some interesting portraits with the latter that you may have seen. Waiting is problematic with digital because everything changes so fast — for the same reason buying is problematic as well.

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/
    yes, i've seen the beautiful, gritty, portraits...and even though I do feel that the grd2 gives somewhat better detail than the gx100, I don't like the idea of carrying the lenses, having to pop stuff on and off the camera body...i like the ease of the zoom to frame and re-frame on the fly,...

    also, for me, the whole gestalt of these small body/small sensor cameras is the absence of weight and extras...simple, fast, unobtrusive...

    i agree with you...waiting is not a good thing, however, the gx100 is a year old now...maybe something will happen between now and august...i'm betting ricoh will add internal memory like they did for the grd2...when, oh when...

    but i will need something relatively soon...i'm giving my F30 to my wife...and need something for an extended stay in New York starting mid April...

    oh, by the way...I've also been looking at the D300 as an upgrade to my aging Canon D60...i agree with your assessment of the grain and higher iso's...i like what nikon is doing, how they handle noise with their dslr's...

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    Member popum's Avatar
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Mitch

    Very interesting thread. I'm dealing with the same issues. I have GRD1 and GRD2 and really appreciate them as street shooters. I just sold my M8 (couldn't get the shots I wanted... my fault) and bought a D300. Used it in the streets of NYC last Saturday with a 35mm prime. I felt it worked very well with the continuous focus and, at least in NYC, didn't evoke any different reaction from folks than did the GRD or M8.

    I'm still learning the D300 but like what I'm getting so far.

    Mike

  18. #18
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Mitch, I just want to add, as others have, that I don't find you pictures getting "stale" at all. Similar theme (streetshooting), but each photo is unique and interesting. Keep up the great work!

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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Was playing with a d300 in a shop recently. It is an incredible piece of technology. It sounds like you fell in love with this aspect, and had to have it. But frankly, I can't imagine it can be better for the style and type of photography you do than the GRD2. Just too many important down sides: viewfinder only, weight + size, dof. And even though it's not as loud as other dslrs it did seem significantly louder than the grd 2. But of course, styles change.

    Is the liveview feature useful at all?

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    Senior Member nostatic's Avatar
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    I can say that I have yet to use liveview on the K20d except to test it. Something about a dslr makes me want to pull it up to my eye. Plus the liveview implementations in dslrs tend to be pretty klunky. Unless you have separate sensors, you are forcing the design to do something it really doesn't want to do.

  21. #21
    Member popum's Avatar
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    My first outing with the D300. Peace rally in Union Square, NYC, last Saturday. Used the 35/2.0 for all shots.

    There were so many photographers I could have been shooting with an 8x10 and not be noticed.

    Mike

  22. #22
    Christi Mac
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Tough Crowd indeed - luckily most of us understand the need to talk about our work on a regular basis especially when that work is ongoing and unified by a single thread. I have to say Mitch - I love the D300 shots, the 2nd and 3rd pictures are incredible in their depth of shadow. But I think the series you're working on just now "needs" the GRD2 to work and remain consistent. There is a dynamism and immediacy to them which I think will not be so forthcoming with a larger camera.

    I got my GX100 just yesterday and while I've noticed - in my own shots - the clipping of highlights and shadows as mentioned in another post here I've also come to learn pretty quickly that these can be worked around fairly easily. This leads me to believe that your style for the street work is very much that, a style which you work to produce rather than simply a factor of the small sensor in the GRDII. As you imply - learning the intricacies of the D300 would allow you to place your light and shade pretty much wherever you want in the image - but I doubt it would ever give you the same freedom. For street-work I think a DSLR could literally be too "in your face".

    That said - Popum - I have done 5x4 streetwork in my time ... close enough?

  23. #23
    Mitch Alland
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Quote Originally Posted by popum View Post
    My first outing with the D300. Peace rally in Union Square, NYC, last Saturday. Used the 35/2.0 for all shots.
    Mike, thanks for posting: I like the second one a lot, also the bokeh in the left upper corner.

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

  24. #24
    Mitch Alland
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Quote Originally Posted by Christi Mac View Post
    Tough Crowd indeed - luckily most of us understand the need to talk about our work on a regular basis especially when that work is ongoing and unified by a single thread. I have to say Mitch - I love the D300 shots, the 2nd and 3rd pictures are incredible in their depth of shadow. But I think the series you're working on just now "needs" the GRD2 to work and remain consistent. There is a dynamism and immediacy to them which I think will not be so forthcoming with a larger camera.
    Christi Mac, Thanks. Yes, it's useful to be forced to say something about one's work when posting it, and therefore having to think about it and getting thoughtful reactions such as yours. You may be right about what you say about the GRD2, but I tend to think that it really depends with how you shoot and post-process: after all a style can have a lot of variation in it in terms of heavy grain and a finer look and still remain expressive and coherent. Some of the books of Moriyama Daido are a good example of this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Christi Mac View Post
    I got my GX100 just yesterday and while I've noticed - in my own shots - the clipping of highlights and shadows as mentioned in another post here I've also come to learn pretty quickly that these can be worked around fairly easily. This leads me to believe that your style for the street work is very much that, a style which you work to produce rather than simply a factor of the small sensor in the GRDII. As you imply - learning the intricacies of the D300 would allow you to place your light and shade pretty much wherever you want in the image - but I doubt it would ever give you the same freedom. For street-work I think a DSLR could literally be too "in your face"...
    That is what I want to find out — and there could be room for both approaches to this type of photography; but you may be right.

    I've posted three more D300 pictures in posting #25 in the other thread:

    http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/showth...?t=1191&page=2

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/
    Last edited by Mitch Alland; 28th March 2008 at 00:29.

  25. #25
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Quote Originally Posted by Mitch Alland View Post

    That is what I want to find out — and there could be room for both approaches to this type of photography; but you may be right.

    I've posted three more D300 pictures in posting #25 in the other thread:

    http://forum.getdpi.com/forum/showth...?t=1191&page=2

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/
    HI Mitch
    I'm intrigued at you using a D300 for your stuff - I'd always felt that it relied mainly on there being nothing between you and your subject and the D300 with the 17-35 certainly isn't 'nothing at all'.
    I don't do street (no streets here), but I do a lot of candid photography, and I hate it with a dSLR, the subjects behave quite differently, even compared with an M8 (perhaps especially compared with an M8).
    I do understand why you bought the D300 (and I know it's an excellent camera), but I would have thought an M8 would serve your street art much better . . . (but then, what do I know?)!

    Just this guy you know

  26. #26
    Mitch Alland
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    ...I do understand why you bought the D300 (and I know it's an excellent camera), but I would have thought an M8 would serve your street art much better . . . (but then, what do I know?)!
    Jono, of course I don't yet know whether I'll end up using the D300 for street photography at all, or end up using it for other types of photography; but that is what 'm shooting here in Tsumeb, a small mining town in Namibia, because there is nothing else here that interests me in shooting, while I try to familiarise myself with the camera so that I can use it in the game parks that we'll be visiting for the next 8-9 days from Monday.

    As I wrote earlier I was dazzled by many of the features of the D300 when I first saw it last Thursday, particularly the fast and accurate autofocus and the lack of shutter lag. I tried the M8 in Tokyo last August at the Ginza Leica salon, which must be the most elegant camera shop in the world, but did not take to it at all — shall we say I was not taken with the gestalt? — unlike my M6, one of which I sold last Fall but so far am keeping the other one (black), although I may soon sell that as well.

    The funny thing — and I think I have referred to this twice in this thread akready — is that my experience with the D300 makes me realize that I really like the huge depth of field of the GRD2 for street photography and am therefore starting to shoot with the D300 at high ISO speeds to allow use of small apertures like f/8 that have a long DOF. That makes me think that I would not be at all eager to get a full-frame version of the D300 if it were to become available. I'm really interested in reading the thoughts of others on this issue.

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/

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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Quote Originally Posted by Mitch Alland View Post

    As I wrote earlier I was dazzled by many of the features of the D300 when I first saw it last Thursday, particularly the fast and accurate autofocus and the lack of shutter lag. I tried the M8 in Tokyo last August at the Ginza Leica salon, which must be the most elegant camera shop in the world, but did not take to it at all — shall we say I was not taken with the gestalt? — unlike my M6, one of which I sold last Fall but so far am keeping the other one (black), although I may soon sell that as well.
    HI There
    Of course, I really do understand about the 'gestalt' of a camera - I like my M8's much better know they look a little 'lived in', but what I really like is people's lack of response when shooting with it (the shutter noise resounds through one's skull, but doesn't seem to travel).

    I used Nikon cameras for many years, ending up with a d2x, a d200 and a heavy bag of lenses - in the end though I didn't like the way Nikon handled greens for landscape work (and there isn't much else around here). I still use a dSLR for around 30% of my work, but it's exclusively Olympus nowadays (love the colour, the lenses, live view with moveable LCD and the weather-resistance, put up with the slightly lower resolution). 4/3 also has the advantage of slightly more depth of field . ..
    Quote Originally Posted by Mitch Alland View Post
    The funny thing — and I think I have referred to this twice in this thread akready — is that my experience with the D300 makes me realize that I really like the huge depth of field of the GRD2 for street photography and am therefore starting to shoot with the D300 at high ISO speeds to allow use of small apertures like f/8 that have a long DOF. That makes me think that I would not be at all eager to get a full-frame version of the D300 if it were to become available. I'm really interested in reading the thoughts of others on this issue.

    —Mitch/Tsumeb, Namibia
    I couldn't agree more - I've been using (and loving) the GX100 for macro work. Sometimes it's good to have less depth of field, but usually more is better.
    Whatever, good luck with your D300, but from my experience I suspect that when you stop being dazzled by the facilities you'll start to be irritated by the bulk, and by people's response to it.

    Just this guy you know

  28. #28
    Senior Member nostatic's Avatar
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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    I was stunned by how fast and accurate the AF is with the D300. It truly is a technological marvel and is about the most advanced performer you can get for under $2K. I had trouble with the interface though, and found the Pentax to be more intuitive. But that is totally personal opinion. I really liked the E3, appreciate the "middle ground" of the 4/3 system, and the 12-60 lens is probably the best I've ever played with. But again it was a personal thing with the interface (the E3 has really small buttons and I have big hands).

    With the Pentax I have ended up running auto ISO and stopping down (as you've done). The good news is that iso1600 looks pretty darn clean and I can go to 3200 if need be. The Nikon is an even better performer at high ISO, but the files look different than the small sensor ones. I've come to like the noise at 800 on the DLux3.

    wrt full frame, odds are you'll be able to shoot like ISO 128000 or some ridiculous number, so you should be able to stop down under most any conditions. What I'm wondering is whether or not you'll be able to "shrink" the sensor size to match lenses that were designed for APS sensors (ie DX series stuff for Nikon).

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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    Quote Originally Posted by nostatic View Post
    I was stunned by how fast and accurate the AF is with the D300. It truly is a technological marvel and is about the most advanced performer you can get for under $2K. I had trouble with the interface though, and found the Pentax to be more intuitive. But that is totally personal opinion. I really liked the E3, appreciate the "middle ground" of the 4/3 system, and the 12-60 lens is probably the best I've ever played with. But again it was a personal thing with the interface (the E3 has really small buttons and I have big hands).
    I think the E3 has some irritating default settings - for instance, setting the buttons to 'sticky' suddenly makes them quite useable (they stay pressed for a set amount of time, or until you tap the shutter or press another button).
    Mind you, I have small hands.
    I was very taken with the K20D when I fiddled with one at focus; so much so that I very nearly bought one, but with the 4/3 system it's the lenses one keeps going back to, and as you say, that 12-60 is such a great lens.

    Quote Originally Posted by nostatic View Post
    With the Pentax I have ended up running auto ISO and stopping down (as you've done). The good news is that iso1600 looks pretty darn clean and I can go to 3200 if need be. The Nikon is an even better performer at high ISO, but the files look different than the small sensor ones. I've come to like the noise at 800 on the DLux3.
    I assume you have the K20D? Are you pleased with it? not trouble with the lenses?

    Just this guy you know

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    Re: Trying to do street photography with the D300 vs GRD2

    I am very happy with the K20d. It has a few quirks, but you learn to work with them. I can be lazy and just shoot program mode with auto iso and the images are stunning. Or I can tweak to my heart's content. The 16-50* lens has had qc issues with a lot of bad copies so I avoided that. But luckily the mid-grade 16-45 performs way better than it should for the price. The 50-135* lens is great, with incredible contrast. And I have the FA77ltd which is sublime art. All of these are well behaved. I'm waiting for the 35mm ltd macro to come out then I'm set. I did have an FA31ltd that had AF issues. I sent the lens back and figure the 35 will cover that region. Plus there is a 15mm ltd on the roadmap. Gotta love their primes...

    The Oly 12-60 though...I still salivate when I think of that lens. Damn near perfect.

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