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Thread: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

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    A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Hello Nice folks of GetDPI forums and Sony A7/7R users,

    I want to know how this camera stacks up in real world use. Specifically the questions asked will be tailored for my use. My main camera is 5D mark III.

    1) Focus hunting in low light and back lighting, is it a problem?
    2) User interface, has it been frustrating?
    3) Shutter response, 'I heard' it's mushy, is it? and is shutter response instant?
    4) Flash use, any experiences with it?
    5) I have no doubt the sensors are great in these cameras, and it allow access to a lot of third party lenses, however, if I stick with the native FE 55 f/1.8, which I see is superb, is this camera a keeper?
    6) What annoys you most or what can be improved with the A7/7R?
    7) What do you love about it, and are you willing to give up your DSLRs for it yet?
    8) Would you take this camera to Disney World as your only camera with kids?

    9) Does it have auto-bracketing up to three exposures apart/user defined... yes, for HDR part of me!

    I'm purposely avoiding the shutter loudness questions, since I know and hopefully time will tell if Sony improves on the A7R with it.

    Well that's it folks, it's a self-serving thread, but I really want to know if this camera is right for me. I want to avoid buying it and then sending it back or putting it up on ebay later!

    Thanks!
    Po
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    I'm still somewhat in the honeymoon phase, but I've had plenty of cameras (including the EM1) that I flipped quickly because I didn't really bond with it.

    1. Reasonable with the 35/2.8 and 55/1.8. I have a GH3 as well and that hunts maybe a bit less in low light but not a huge difference.
    2. No worse than any other modern camera. Physical ergonomics are highly personal (I like the A7 a lot), menus/etc are fine.
    3. No complaints. I actually had a worse time with the EM1 which was a hair trigger.
    4. Never used a flash.
    5. I have the 35/2.8, 55/1.8, and kit zoom. Have the 28-70/4 on order. Frankly the 35 and 55 are so good I'm willing to work around things. I would love a longer macro/portrait but that's about it. That said, I have a 6D with 16-35/2.8 if I need really wide.
    6. I wish it had sensor stabilization because I shoot a lot of handheld and low light. The Zeiss zoom may cover part of that.
    7. I've already sold off most of my u4/3 except for GH3 and 12-35/35-100 combo for video. My wife wants to keep the 6D for shooting her sculpture work but that may go as well. Right now it is RX100ii and A7. Mostly I just find it really fun to shoot, the quirks end up making me more involved in the process (instead of just point and snap), and the files are awesome.
    8. I hate theme parks, but I happily take this on walks to the beach. If you really need tracking AF, you're probably stuck with a dSLR.
    9. don't know

    fwiw I like the sound of the shutter, though it is disruptive if it is quiet. Something like the RX100 or GM1 is dead silent, but the A7 is comparable to the 6D.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Thank you Nostatic, it was enjoyable and very helpful reading your user experience.
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    Hello Nice folks of GetDPI forums and Sony A7/7R users,

    I want to know how this camera stacks up in real world use. Specifically the questions asked will be tailored for my use. My main camera is 5D mark III.

    1) Focus hunting in low light and back lighting, is it a problem?
    2) User interface, has it been frustrating?
    3) Shutter response, 'I heard' it's mushy, is it? and is shutter response instant?
    4) Flash use, any experiences with it?
    5) I have no doubt the sensors are great in these cameras, and it allow access to a lot of third party lenses, however, if I stick with the native FE 55 f/1.8, which I see is superb, is this camera a keeper?
    6) What annoys you most or what can be improved with the A7/7R?
    7) What do you love about it, and are you willing to give up your DSLRs for it yet?
    8) Would you take this camera to Disney World as your only camera with kids?

    9) Does it have auto-bracketing up to three exposures apart/user defined... yes, for HDR part of me!

    I'm purposely avoiding the shutter loudness questions, since I know and hopefully time will tell if Sony improves on the A7R with it.

    Well that's it folks, it's a self-serving thread, but I really want to know if this camera is right for me. I want to avoid buying it and then sending it back or putting it up on ebay later!

    Thanks!
    Po
    Coming from a 5D3 to an A7r.

    1. Using Manual Lenses
    2. Yes to be honest. Not that bad though. I wish to heck there was a 'my menu' though.
    3. Think about 3 times the lag of the 5D3. I couldn't use this camera personally for events and find portraiture where the subject is moving difficult. The A7 is apparently not a problem due to electronic shutter.
    4. I've used it with studio lighting. You have to turn off the live view showing settings so you can't have it showing B&W or higher contrast to assist manual focus.
    5. That lens is second only to the Otus. If you like your lenses modern/perfect then I'd assume the answer is yes.
    6. Shutter lag and the placement of the shutter release button.
    7. I did. Simply I can fit the camera and 3 lenses, with adaptors, in the same space that my 5D3 with 50L attached took up. It's tiny, light and with some judicious gaffer looks like a 30 year old manual SLR. The image quality beats the 5D3 hands down for colour, tonality and DR. I've never had files just so easy to work with or which indeed need so little work.
    8. The A7 with kit zoom would be perfect for this. No lag problems when trying to capture them on the rides and the kit zoom seems to be a great lens. I wouldn't try it with the A7r. I took it on vacation with me in December but found myself wishing for a point and shoot.
    9. Yes either a 5 shot bracket in 0.5 steps or a 3 shot bracket in 2 stop steps. I wish it would allow you to choose exactly how many stops to bracket though. Rather weird implementation.
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Rubinstein View Post
    7. I did. Simply I can fit the camera and 4 lenses, with adaptors, in the same space that my 5D3 with 50L attached took up. The image quality beats the 5D3 hands down for colour, tonality and DR. I've never had files just so easy to work with or which indeed need so little work.
    8. The A7 with kit zoom would be perfect for this. No lag problems when trying to capture them on the rides and the kit zoom seems to be a great lens. I wouldn't try it with the A7r. I took it on vacation with me in December but found myself wishing for a point and shoot.
    Two key points. The A7 with the kit zoom has no business being so good considering the size/weight while still retaining usability. It is a bit smaller than my GH3, only advantage is the 35-100/2.8 which doesn't have an equivalent yet, and likely won't at least in the same size/weight. But everything is a compromise. The files out of the A7 are much more flexible than the ones out of the GH3 (which I like a lot btw).

    For point and shoot, I sold my GM1 (which is a great little camera) and picked up an RX100ii after getting the A7. A bit more pocketable than the GM1, and more similar interface to the A7. Surprisingly not much iq drop, but is a little slower than the Panny. That compromise thing again...

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    I just bought a Fuji XF1 (in tan) actually for the new 'family' camera. Dirt cheap style. I was going to get the GM1 but the flash sync killed it for me.
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Thanks for sharing Ben!
    I'm surprised about the 7) with the IQ beating the 5D3. I also have the D800 but think of selling it if I go for the A7/R. However, a lot depends on the usability and the speed and tactile feel of the camera I am trying to gauge.

    8) I'm glad you made a comparative experience, it's a difficult one to explain without real world experience.
    9) Something I love about the 5D3!

    The 5D3 is almost perfect for me, except for size and weight for the 'different occassions' but I almost always just tough it out and take it with me and all works out. However, the problem is 'sometimes' despite me leaving home with the camera I don't take it out of the bag because of the kids, and just too much work!

    Both my wife and I love the IQ from the 5D3, and if the he A7 and not the R is better for speed, I will take a serious look. On the other hand, if operation is a concern I will consider the just announced Fuji XT1, especially with its already good selection of native X-lenses.
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Have to admit that the XT-1 seems like an incredible camera.

    Re IQ here is an interesting review which shows just how much better the Sony is in the shadows. Sony A7R teams up with Canon glass
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    My A7R experiences so far, including shooting events as well a walk-about street work:

    1) Haven't noticed AF issues. I assigned AF to the rear thumb button like all my other cameras. Reports suggest the A7R is actually a bit faster in lower light than the A7. Fastest AF I've experienced with the camera has been with SSM A mount lenses using the Sony LAEA-4 adapter as fast as my A99 35mm DSLR.

    2) I haven't figured out how to move the AF square around in the viewfinder the same easy way you can with a Canon, Nikon or Sony DSLR. Right now it takes multiple presses to get there. Probably can do it, but I haven't figured out how yet. Otherwise the interface could be simplified, but I don't use to many different settings so it's fine for now. I haven't delved into it enough to assign ISO to a separate button yet so I've had to bring up the on-screen menu for now.

    3) Haven't noticed a mushy shutter button if that's what you mean. Maybe because I've assigned AF to the rear thumb button?

    4) I use flash a lot, but the issue is most capable bounce flashes are huge on such a small camera and unbalance it a lot. I've tried a few smaller flashes set to A just for fill, but any real strobist work is difficult with such a tiny camera. I tend to use it as an available light camera because the higher ISO performance is so good.

    The upside of being so small is that you can hold the speed-light in one hand and the camera with a wrist strap in the other, and use a radio trigger for off-camera flash without all the strain a bigger camera places on your wrist and forearm.

    5) It's a keeper for me. Pluses far outweigh any minuses. Wasn't interested in the A7 as I already have two other 24 meg FF cameras I wanted the bigger file of the A7R.

    6) For me, the real irritation is that you cannot have live view in the viewfinder and instant review of the last shot on the LCD. You have to turn off the LCD review, and after a shot press the review button to see the last shot taken. Hate that! (BTW, the A99 is the same).

    7) Likes: The file quality and higher ISO performance, ability to use many lenses I already have. No, not willing to part with my 35mm FF DSLRs yet my A99 has IBIS, shoots to two cards, has a more artuclulated LCD screen, and is far more suited to flash photography and for paying work is battle tested, where this camera is not (in time we'll see how it holds up).

    8) Yes.

    9) Don't know.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Thank you Marc!

    I'm interested to know how accurate AF is with using A mount lenses, I tend to have reservations about adapters both with concerns about responsiveness and IQ. I know telephotos are on it's way, but who knows the A-mounts are a good option while we wait!


    4) is my concern, I love using flashes, sometime natural light just isn't enough, and almost always guarantee a good look (users experiences vary of course! ;p)

    Also I only wish camera manufactures would make all flash no matter how small to rotate and allow for bounce! Radio control on my Canon flash is totally awesome!

    6) I can see how that might be annoying! Sony should take note here!

    7) Knowing that you use the Leica S, and to credit the A7r for file quality is saying a lot!
    My initially viewing the Fun with thread didn't impress me, but now users are warming up to the camera, I am quite impressed.

    I am still undecided because the Fuji XT1 looks really good (price too with a couple of lenses), I have owned the X100 in the past and a couple of other APS-C cameras, I have never got on well with them. FF make enough of a difference for me and is apparent. I hope the size and handling together with the 55 f/1.8 can be a winner.
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    Thank you Marc!

    I'm interested to know how accurate AF is with using A mount lenses, I tend to have reservations about adapters both with concerns about responsiveness and IQ. I know telephotos are on it's way, but who knows the A-mounts are a good option while we wait!


    4) is my concern, I love using flashes, sometime natural light just isn't enough, and almost always guarantee a good look (users experiences vary of course! ;p)

    Also I only wish camera manufactures would make all flash no matter how small to rotate and allow for bounce! Radio control on my Canon flash is totally awesome!

    6) I can see how that might be annoying! Sony should take note here!

    7) Knowing that you use the Leica S, and to credit the A7r for file quality is saying a lot!
    My initially viewing the Fun with thread didn't impress me, but now users are warming up to the camera, I am quite impressed.

    I am still undecided because the Fuji XT1 looks really good (price too with a couple of lenses), I have owned the X100 in the past and a couple of other APS-C cameras, I have never got on well with them. FF make enough of a difference for me and is apparent. I hope the size and handling together with the 55 f/1.8 can be a winner.
    I found the AF success rate with the A mount lenses using the LAEA4 Sony adapter very high in terms of both speed and accuracy which can be expected because it is a Sony product made specifically for this camera.

    The caveat to that is that not all A mounts utilize SSM and the screw drive ones are a bit slower and can hunt a bit more. I use the ZA24/2 with SSM a lot on this camera as it is relatively small and an excellent optic that stands up to 36 meg.

    - Marc

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Thanks Marc! I heard the SSM motor use tends to drain the battery, and knowing the A7/R already suffer from shorter battery life, do you find this significant or not really?
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    .

    2) I haven't figured out how to move the AF square around in the viewfinder the same easy way you can with a Canon, Nikon or Sony DSLR. Right now it takes multiple presses to get there. Probably can do it, but I haven't figured out how yet. Otherwise the interface could be simplified, but I don't use to many different settings so it's fine for now. I haven't delved into it enough to assign ISO to a separate button yet so I've had to bring up the on-screen menu for now.
    This was bugging me for a long time, and I think I have figured it out although it does take one more button push.

    Choose your "Focus Area" as flex spot. This is really the only one that allows you to move the focus spot anyway. Then assign "Focus Setting" to one of the Cn buttons. If you push the Cn button you assigned, it will give you the grid and you can use the control wheel/joystick thingy to select the point. You DON'T have to use the centre button to select, as soon you you move the point, it is active. You can also reset to centre by pushing "trash".

    So pushing the Cn button is the only extra step compared to Nikon/Nikon. On the plus side, the area covered by the selectable focus point is far larger relative to the total frame.

    BTW, you could also assign the "Focus Setting" to the centre button, so it is very close to the joystick and you would not have to fumble with buttons with your eye to the VF. I have my center button set for AF, so had to use C1.

    Hope this helps...Cheers.

    PS. I have no idea what they were thinking when they came up with "Focus Area", "Focus Settings" and "Focus Mode"

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    I used my Cn 3 button for this. I hit the button and I just move my AF square around with the dial. I'll double check my settings for this and report in morning
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    I used my Cn 3 button for this. I hit the button and I just move my AF square around with the dial. I'll double check my settings for this and report in morning
    Thanks Guy!

    - Marc

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    Thanks Marc! I heard the SSM motor use tends to drain the battery, and knowing the A7/R already suffer from shorter battery life, do you find this significant or not really?
    Not really, but I'm not a machine gun type shooter plus, as I mentioned, I shut off the LCD which probably saves battery power.

    - Marc

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Thanks for all the input guys, all good to know!

    I should ask one more question, like this custom AF button assign:
    10) Please share any interface or user tips.

    I think it was on the RX1, it was being able to make the the AF rectangle smaller, not sure if I have that confused with another camera like the EM-5!

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    Thanks for all the input guys, all good to know!

    I should ask one more question, like this custom AF button assign:
    10) Please share any interface or user tips.

    I think it was on the RX1, it was being able to make the the AF rectangle smaller, not sure if I have that confused with another camera like the EM-5!

    Po
    Yup, you can choose small/med/large for the focus point and move it around as well, pretty much around most of the frame
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Very nice feature too. I mostly use the smallest but it's really to taste.
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    I used smallest in the center and AF-recompose. That way I don't have to move the focus point around. Has its own issues but works for me most of the time.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    I also own a 5D III and find the A7 IQ better too.

    The comment about files just being 'right' form the get-go is true. Skin tones are absolutely perfect. The dynamic range and file flexibility is phenomenal.

    Neither the A7 nor the A7R are as 'dynamic' as the 5D III, the latter being one of the best cameras at any price in this regard. Everything about the 5D III's function seems spot on to me; the only flaw being the sensor's read noise/banding and limited dynamic range.

    So, you can expect a somewhat slower less 'racy' feel from the A7. I prefer the 5D III for portraits due to the perfect shutter release (it is a bit lacking in crisp feel on the A7) and the AF is in a different league when subjects are mobile. The A7 does not seriously challenge the 5D III in what SLRs do best, but as a travel or landscape camera, its absolutely brilliant.

    I also prefer the live view on the Canon. Much nicer.

    But the A7 is tiny, much cheaper and can use pretty well any lens on the planet. Its a game changer for me.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Actually a key advantage of the A7 for me is "live view" through the EVF. I have a tough time judging focus on the rear LCD on the 6D and when my wife uses it to shoot B-roll footage often ends up out of focus. It would be much easier to see through the VF, but no VF in live view. For me this is a big win for any of the good EVFs. But depends on how your shoot.
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    I used my Cn 3 button for this. I hit the button and I just move my AF square around with the dial. I'll double check my settings for this and report in morning
    Im quoting myself here . Marc in menu go to gear wheel, 6 , custom settings, custom button 3 set it for focus settings..

    Than you can move the AF square around via the upper dials on top deck or through the rotating dial on back. You actually get 2 options which is very nice. One feature i really like here is this ability and hitting Custom 3 button is fairly easy when shooting. C2 I set it to turn OFF LCD. Its a button that is hard to get too for a left eyed shooter so I made it the least popular setting. I made C1 Focus area so I can set the AF square or go to a zone focusing , wide or whatever you need. I find the C1 and C3 great for the AF glass. I also use the Fn button a lot to dive in where I need to go and make a quick change.
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    I have a complete Olympus E-M1 kit and bought the A7 as a body for my Leica R and Nikkor SLR lenses. I've only been using the A7 for a week or so, lightly.

    1- no experience with A7 AF

    2- compared to the Olympus, buttons and dials are scattered and not a particularly ergonomic layout. The menus are a scattered mess. However, once through the pain of figuring everything out and configuring the camera for use with my lenses, it works well and I don't need to dip into the menu system very often.

    Also, the Sony documentation sucks. Be sure you download the additional documentation from the Sony site ("ILCE-7_7R_guide_EN.pdf") as the supplied docs have little detail. (Truth be told, the Olympus supplied docs are similarly stupidly abbreviated and you have to download the full instruction manual from the website, but their documentation is still MUCH better than the Sony crap.)

    3- It's on the order of responsiveness as the Leica M9, and not as responsive as the E-M1. The A7 in general is slower operating than the E-M1 ... not to day that it's slow, its responsiveness just calls for a less bang-bang shooting pace.

    4- no experience yet

    5- I imagine the very best lenses to use, particular for the A7r, will be the top of the line Sony/Zeiss lenses. That said, my Leica R lenses seem to be a very very good optical match to the A7 sensor and I'm quite happy to stick with them exclusively.

    6- not enough experience yet to say.

    7- I gave up DSLRs a long time ago, except for my all time favorite the Olympus E-1.

    8- I would take any camera I own to Disney World with anyone I go with. I generally loathe theme parks, though.

    9- Yes, various types of bracketing are included, but whether it does exactly what you want I'm not sure.

    10- The A7 shutter is a little bit noisy, I suspect the A7r a bit more so, but I don't understand all the hullaballoo about it. Most of the people complaining have evidently never used a Nikon FM with MD-12 motor drive ... ;-)

    I like the A7 for my intended use of it. The Leica R lenses I've tested on it so far image with almost exactly the same characteristics that I see them produce on film in the Leicaflex SL, so it achieves my goal of a "Leicaflex SL Digital" surrogate. It operates at about the same pace, and has a viewfinder that is quite close in quality (the E-M1 viewfinder is ever so slightly nicer, I think due to better optics). The mount adapter for R lenses is deep, which gives me something to hold onto and helps make the little body and big, heavy lenses balance well. It's a little rough around the edges, but I'm sure it will work nicely.

    I'd use the E-M1 with its excellent native lenses and their AF to shoot faster moving subject matter as it's a better camera for that purpose, but I have no problem shooting manually with the A7 on the same subjects.

    G

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by turtle View Post
    I also own a 5D III and find the A7 IQ better too.

    The comment about files just being 'right' form the get-go is true. Skin tones are absolutely perfect. The dynamic range and file flexibility is phenomenal.

    Neither the A7 nor the A7R are as 'dynamic' as the 5D III, the latter being one of the best cameras at any price in this regard. Everything about the 5D III's function seems spot on to me; the only flaw being the sensor's read noise/banding and limited dynamic range.

    So, you can expect a somewhat slower less 'racy' feel from the A7. I prefer the 5D III for portraits due to the perfect shutter release (it is a bit lacking in crisp feel on the A7) and the AF is in a different league when subjects are mobile. The A7 does not seriously challenge the 5D III in what SLRs do best, but as a travel or landscape camera, its absolutely brilliant.

    I also prefer the live view on the Canon. Much nicer.

    But the A7 is tiny, much cheaper and can use pretty well any lens on the planet. Its a game changer for me.
    I am actually hoping for much of my experience to be similar to yours! I agree the 5D3 is a great camera period. All the fuss about about the lack of DR in canon sensors are true but to the extent people make out, I don't really agree. When used with their great lenses i really have little to quibble about!

    I really hope the A7 will turn out to be a great travel camera and not just an expense where i feel i made a mistake for not taking the 5D3 instead.
    If you or anyone can share how well the 55FE lens focuses speed wise, I think my overall idea will be built around the camera.

    The only other my research has lead me to believe is that the sony alpha lens adapter with alpha lenses will focus faster than the native 55!

    Thanks,
    Po
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Hi Po, I'd be amazed if you were to complete a travel experience and come home wishing you'd had the 5D III, but YMMV. I suspect you'll be grateful for the small and light A7 at the end of each day. Actually, most likely before lunchtime....

    Unless you really need the ultra-responsiveness of the 5D III, the A7 does everything else beautifully. I agree on what you say regarding the 5D III's dynamic range. Most of the time its irrelevant, but its nice to fall back on the dynamic range of the Sony files when you can't pick and choose the lighting.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    I am actually hoping for much of my experience to be similar to yours! I agree the 5D3 is a great camera period. All the fuss about about the lack of DR in canon sensors are true but to the extent people make out, I don't really agree. When used with their great lenses i really have little to quibble about!

    I really hope the A7 will turn out to be a great travel camera and not just an expense where i feel i made a mistake for not taking the 5D3 instead.
    If you or anyone can share how well the 55FE lens focuses speed wise, I think my overall idea will be built around the camera.

    The only other my research has lead me to believe is that the sony alpha lens adapter with alpha lenses will focus faster than the native 55!

    Thanks,
    Po
    I think it is a big task for a new camera to swiftly replace one that is trusted and familiar. It just takes time. When I went from the A900 DSLR to the A99 SLT, I was uncomfortable with it for some time. Now the A99 is the one I grab first. I'm not totally comfortable with the A7R yet, but have faith I will be in time practice brings that comfortable familiarity eventually then the camera disappears, and becomes an extension of your vision.

    Both the FE35 and FE55 AF quite nicely pretty close to the A mount lenses with SSM on the LAEA4 adapter depending on which A lens as some are a little faster than others. You have to experiment with the AF settings to find the optimal configurations for the way you shoot.

    More fun and trust to come as we all get more and more familiar and practiced with this camera.

    - Marc

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Marc, i dont think the A7 can replace my 5D3, but i hope it fits where I believe it to go and certainly where my 5D3 need not!

    That said I bit the bullet today... looking forward to some magic moments.
    Thanks for all the sharing... i already have a couple of Sony flashes, i still wish they can further improve in this arena, especially in smaller size and articulation!
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    Hello Nice folks of GetDPI forums and Sony A7/7R users,

    I want to know how this camera stacks up in real world use. Specifically the questions asked will be tailored for my use. My main camera is 5D mark III.

    1) Focus hunting in low light and back lighting, is it a problem?
    2) User interface, has it been frustrating?
    3) Shutter response, 'I heard' it's mushy, is it? and is shutter response instant?
    4) Flash use, any experiences with it?
    5) I have no doubt the sensors are great in these cameras, and it allow access to a lot of third party lenses, however, if I stick with the native FE 55 f/1.8, which I see is superb, is this camera a keeper?
    6) What annoys you most or what can be improved with the A7/7R?
    7) What do you love about it, and are you willing to give up your DSLRs for it yet?
    8) Would you take this camera to Disney World as your only camera with kids?

    9) Does it have auto-bracketing up to three exposures apart/user defined... yes, for HDR part of me!


    Thanks!
    Po
    1. haven't used AF
    2. menus are MUCH better than the Nex. Controls are mostly same or a bit better than the Nex-7, with the exception of zooming in/out in "review" mode which is pretty horrible (they picked weird buttons and you can't change them)
    3. The shutter button is mushy and though I don't notice it much in the field, it's an annoying step backwards from the Nex IMO
    4. no experience
    5. the FE55 looks outstanding, and this is the only camera you can use it on, so. . .
    6. A7: the ray-gun flare on bright lights in night shots; the corner smearing with wide-angle RF lenses
    7. never owned a DSLR, upgraded from Nex. The Nex-7 was great, but getting the "real" results from my lenses is worth it, and the high-ISO performance is hugely better on the A7 than it was on the Nex-7.
    8. haven't used the FE lenses, so hard to say. Sounds like they'd be fine for that.
    9. dunno

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    Marc, i dont think the A7 can replace my 5D3, but i hope it fits where I believe it to go and certainly where my 5D3 need not!

    That said I bit the bullet today... looking forward to some magic moments.
    Thanks for all the sharing... i already have a couple of Sony flashes, i still wish they can further improve in this arena, especially in smaller size and articulation!
    Yeah, my FF 35mm DSLR/SLT type cameras aren't going anywhere soon I need them for the select weddings, parties and events I still shoot from time-to-time.

    However, I can foresee the time when I'll dump it all for one tiny system like this, and my Leica S2, and call it a day.

    The speed-light situation for most small cameras is pretty poor it seems like a real upcoming opportunity for someone to cash in on that vacuum in proper lighting for these little guys. Sooner would be better than later.

    - Marc

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Well well well. I'm the crazy one for sure. The Sonys both a7 and A7r have replaced my Nikon system. Have to say and after doing a really big runway gig, workshop and client work that I have yet to hit the oh **** wall that I can't do something but on my radar screen I need a tethered solution at the end of the month . 2 days in the studio shooting models and cloths. Basically a catalog shoot. Gear not the issue as I have what I need its the tethered I need to figure out and be rock solid on it. So far so good but I can understand Marc's and others decision to hold on for awhile. Now I'm not completely crazy as I held unto some Nikon mounts as if it gets too much I can go rent. But I'm going to say this without hard proof but more on my experience and I feel my files are actually better at least in the area of color and look. I'm liking the color better over my Nikons. That was a risk I took in switching was I wanted better color and I believe that thought pattern panned out with the Sony. I'm not going to run a side by side on it but I'm going with my gut feeling on the Sonys.

    I'm going to add a comment here and I maybe proved wrong but I feel everyone seems stuck in the mud and Sony is actually innovating
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Well well well. I'm the crazy one for sure. The Sonys both a7 and A7r have replaced my Nikon system. Have to say and after doing a really big runway gig, workshop and client work that I have yet to hit the oh **** wall that I can't do something but on my radar screen I need a tethered solution at the end of the month . 2 days in the studio shooting models and cloths. Basically a catalog shoot. Gear not the issue as I have what I need its the tethered I need to figure out and be rock solid on it. So far so good but I can understand Marc's and others decision to hold on for awhile. Now I'm not completely crazy as I held unto some Nikon mounts as if it gets too much I can go rent. But I'm going to say this without hard proof but more on my experience and I feel my files are actually better at least in the area of color and look. I'm liking the color better over my Nikons. That was a risk I took in switching was I wanted better color and I believe that thought pattern panned out with the Sony. I'm not going to run a side by side on it but I'm going with my gut feeling on the Sonys.

    I'm going to add a comment here and I maybe proved wrong but I feel everyone seems stuck in the mud and Sony is actually innovating
    I agree Guy. There are a lot of 500lb Gorrilas (and their owners) rattling the cage in mock fury and outrage at this upstart "Mighty Mouse" camera which we have to remember is only the first of its type, and most assuredly won't be the last what's next may well give 'em a heart attack

    It isn't as if they weren't warned. I think the handwriting was on the wall some time ago.

    Now we can sit back and see what the response is as we move into the future.

    At this price point it isn't much of a risk . it's not like the cameras will all suddenly stop delivering the excellent stuff everyone seems to be getting out of them.

    - Marc
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Exactly our risk factor is low. Lenses are always the best investment anyway and if Sony just happened to come out with a new body today it would be a low money output to even jump on it. I figure it I can even sell my A7 today and if a A mount just appeared I could even add that. My feeling all along was if I go Sony there sure to be more bodies coming. Canon / Nikon have really not done much lately to make me buy or stay. The DF is nice but it's not a main cam for me. Canon went video plane and simple. I'll take the risk here as it's really low dollars. It's not like risking a 35 k back.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    I'm going to add a comment here and I maybe proved wrong but I feel everyone seems stuck in the mud and Sony is actually innovating
    Sony is innovating in the sense that they seem to have the buying power to make random products in the hope that one will "stick", such as the A7, it's something only a wealthy international conglomerate can do. Now that they've seen the positive reactions, it only made sense that they dropped the NEX moniker and shifted focus on the Alpha series, everything leading up to this was a beta test for Sony's cameras of the future.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    I need a tethered solution at the end of the month . 2 days in the studio shooting models and cloths.
    Guy, have you tried the WIFI tethering on the A7/A7R with an iPad. I have found it quite steady, certainly more stable than the phase WIFI tethering.

    The really nice thing abut it is touch focussing on the large screen. Added bonuses include a great preview/review.

    The file that is downloaded to the iPad can be set for different sizes, but if you want proper image review, this may take some time. Another option may be to send the captured image to a computer and keep the iPad for triggering, focus, preview etc. I have not tried this, but it should work.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Well I need to shoot the cam myself and just have images pop up for a client on the computer so I don't need the remote part but a IPad part could work. But no I have not tried anything yet and was planning on trying this week. I don't mind being hard wired. I might be able to do a hot folder in CI . Lightroom I would have to buy if I went that route. That I don't mind doing.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kolor-Pikker View Post
    Sony is innovating in the sense that they seem to have the buying power to make random products in the hope that one will "stick", such as the A7, it's something only a wealthy international conglomerate can do. Now that they've seen the positive reactions, it only made sense that they dropped the NEX moniker and shifted focus on the Alpha series, everything leading up to this was a beta test for Sony's cameras of the future.
    Not so sure how "wealthy" they are having just been downgraded to junk bond status by Moody mostly due to a poor innovation track record in electronics (TVs, Phones, tablets and laptops) but the imaging division seems to be holding its own, at least for now.

    Seems they aren't risk adverse it's not like the mirrorless category has been setting the world on fire with sales in an already shrinking camera market (thanks to smart phones).

    I do know that these bigger corporations often play the "market share game" longer term i.e., grab a bigger slice of the shrinking pie, and hope the pie gets bigger again later. Either way, if they succeed its a win, or an even bigger win.

    I've read research that purports consumers stopped buying P&S and smaller sensor cameras because they don't see the difference compared to their phone, and their phone lets them directly up-load to social sites so they tend to keep their 35mm DSLR which they still think is better for some family stuff, etc..

    So, the current frontier is smaller, more convenient to carry cameras with the performance of their big DSLRs My bet is this is where a lot of the competitive activity will take place in future (already is happening) unless Canon and Nikon have completely fallen asleep at the wheel.

    Perfect! Just as my body starts falling apart, the stuff is getting smaller Thank God!

    - Marc
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Dang this I get more in my bag or worse I have lens slots waiting to be filled. Lol
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Dang this I get more in my bag or worse I have lens slots waiting to be filled. Lol
    Those slots are now for apples, candy bars, cans of beer and other essentials

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    No they must be filled with glass. Its a unbroken law. LOL

    Just got a 80 dollar rewards from B&H. That could lead to trouble
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Guy, you are a (gear) WHORE!
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Well well well. I'm the crazy one for sure. The Sonys both a7 and A7r have replaced my Nikon system. Have to say and after doing a really big runway gig, workshop and client work that I have yet to hit the oh **** wall that I can't do something but on my radar screen I need a tethered solution at the end of the month . 2 days in the studio shooting models and cloths. Basically a catalog shoot. Gear not the issue as I have what I need its the tethered I need to figure out and be rock solid on it. So far so good but I can understand Marc's and others decision to hold on for awhile. Now I'm not completely crazy as I held unto some Nikon mounts as if it gets too much I can go rent. But I'm going to say this without hard proof but more on my experience and I feel my files are actually better at least in the area of color and look. I'm liking the color better over my Nikons. That was a risk I took in switching was I wanted better color and I believe that thought pattern panned out with the Sony. I'm not going to run a side by side on it but I'm going with my gut feeling on the Sonys.

    I'm going to add a comment here and I maybe proved wrong but I feel everyone seems stuck in the mud and Sony is actually innovating
    This is a pretty amazing endorsement. Something about the files hooked me as well. This morning I shot the A7 and 6D back to back and while it isn't night and day with the shots, I did prefer the A7 and then there is the whole size/weight thing. Plus I'm a sucker for one or two small/well-crafted primes that really send me. That can actually make me happy with a whole system. The Pentax ltd primes were awesome, and I just loved the 77/1.8 for whatever reason. The FE 55/1.8 is proving to be one of those lenses.

    Now I'm just trying to keep from adding an A7R. I don't need to print big, but I often do end up doing heavy crops, especially since I don't have any long glass for this. I had a Fuji XT1 on order as I thought I'd switch back to APS-C for when I need longer reach but since I've got a GH3 that I use mostly for video, seems I should just get a Panny 100-300mm for the rare occasion I need something that long.

    The one thing I am missing is a longer/macro. Seems that an adapter is the only way to go, though that was another reason to pick up the Fuji (shoot their 60/2.4 macro). That said, the Panaleica 45/2.8 on the GH3 could be a solution as well.

    Trying to get all my bases covered, and seems like 1" (RX100), u4/3 or APS-C, and A7(r) does that. I need some silent shooters, often need to grab video, and am no longer willing to carry big gear. We are pretty spoiled these days...

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Well, I picked up Guy's and used my pre-purchase checklist on it.
    I have not bought one.
    YMMV
    -bob

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    I have heavily invested into Sony system since A900 was launched. What I like about Sony is their sensor technology and the way they render color. But the main reason that I got into A7r is to use my Leica R glasses. Because of that, I am keeping the A7r. To me, it won't reply my Leica M system, nor my DSLRs.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by tashley View Post
    Guy, you are a (gear) WHORE!
    Geez I would never have thought that of myself. I'll just call it a great quality of my personality. How's that. ROTFLMAO
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    ... I need a tethered solution at the end of the month . 2 days in the studio shooting models and cloths. ...
    The Eye-Fi wireless 16G card tethered to an iPad or desktop system seems quite sprightly for JPEG file review. 2-3 seconds per full resolution JPEG with the E-M1—haven't tested with the A7 yet.

    Hmm, should drag it out and give it a shot.

    G

    addendum:
    With A7:: did some testing. Full resolution JPEG transfer in 3-5 seconds, full resolution JPEG and raw in about 30 seconds (including auto-import to Lightroom). That's to the Mac mini over my home wireless.
    Last edited by Godfrey; 2nd February 2014 at 13:53.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob View Post
    Well, I picked up Guy's and used my pre-purchase checklist on it.
    I have not bought one.
    YMMV
    -bob
    Out of curiosity Bob, which hurdles did it fall at?

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Okay guys, how do I turn off that auto focusing, without me actually pressing any buttons?
    This always has me boggled!
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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Depends on lens but Native lenses like the 35 and 55 FE just turn the focusing ring and it switches to manual magnified view. Very cool
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: A7/7R user experiences wanted: Is it a keeper?

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    Okay guys, how do I turn off that auto focusing, without me actually pressing any buttons?
    This always has me boggled!
    You mean with a Sony AF lens? I dunno. With a manual lens, the A7 is automatically always in MF mode. Just be sure you (one time) enable "shoot without lens" in the menus.

    G

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