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OMG!

Brian Mosley

New member
I don't know - Olympus seem to have a good eye for camera esthetics... at least to my taste.

I do like that Pentax tried to go 'out there' on their camera design - and wouldn't write it off on looks, before trying it for feel. Looks can be deceptive.

Cheers

Brian
 

kwalsh

New member
But I don't see this as an issue because the measurements are all equal for all cameras. So if a camera is ranked at 12 stops, and another at 10, I certainly would expect a comparative difference here.
Only if the SNR curves are linear, which they are not. That was my point. For the GX1 and GH2 for example going from 0dB to around 12dB takes the difference in DR from 0.9EV to 0.6EV. Not a huge difference, to be sure, but not the same either.

This is also why the MF sensors look so "poor" on DxO. Using 0dB as the reference the K5 vs the 645D gives you 13.6 vs 11.3. Using 20dB gives 8.4 vs 7.5. That's 2.3 stops difference with one measure, 0.9 stops with another. The choice of DR measurement level can't be arbitrary without imparting an arbitrary bias to the differences between sensors.

It is just the problem with trying to take a complex system and boil it down to a single number. Certainly the numbers do indicate which sensor has the lower read noise, and that means the lower shadow noise as well. The issue is that the differences can be arbitrary magnified. They of course don't include things like WB which can be as large a difference as well - especially when you consider most low light shooting is tungsten.

So when you see differences at a fraction of a EV on DxO one should be really careful to start looking at real images instead. When you see huge differences (e.g. K5/D7000 vs m43) then you can be fairly confident you'll see a noticeable difference in real world shooting.

So I still don't understand how DXo doing it that way still fails to account for real world photographic DR we can use.
It's just a question of what SNR level to use. Why not use -20dB instead? Then the GH2 and K5 advantage would be even more EV. Why 0db? Because it is a round number? Go push shadows to the level that DxO claims for the dynamic range and see if you consider them useful - they aren't. So maybe 10dB or 15dB is a better number?

Again, if you could arbitrarily chose an SNR number and it wouldn't affect the differences between cameras then that would be fine. But that is not the case, what level you choose does affect the differences. Not necessarily between all cameras, and not necessarily by huge amounts, but on the other hand you have forum nuts belittling sensors that have DxO DR measurements of a fraction of an EV lower than other sensors and as just demonstrated the choice in SNR level can affect the measurements by that much or more.

Ken
 

greypilgrim

New member
I'm a little surprised at the positive reaction to the looks of it, when so much criticism was dumped on the Panosonic G1 for the "faux" bump on the top. Can't get anymore "faux" than the OM bump - no prism in that prism housing!
It would be nice to get a real motor in that bolt-on battery grip, so it would remind us of film moving through this thing.
I admire Pentax's sentiments with the fresh modern K-01 design rather than this Oly OM rehash.

Keith
I'm somewhat agnostic to the looks, but at first glance, it appears to be a camera that will handle well for me. I have never minded the "hump" on the G series either though.

The Pentax design definitely didn't work for me with respect to functionality: no viewfinder, no tilting screen. The whole holding the camera out at arms length thing...

So far, I am remaining quite positive about this one. Waiting to see real world info about the IQ and how the controls are laid out and used. It has pretty much everything else I could ask for.

Doug
 

ggibson

Well-known member
Still want to hear what the flash sync speed is (hoping for 1/250), but I'm buying one. No doubt about it now.
You got your wish according to 43rumors... 1/250th sync speed.

I'm wondering what the video improvements are, since rumors indicated that the EM-5's video quality was better than the GH2. Since it's likely using the G3/GX1 sensor (analog), I'm slightly doubtful.
 

RichA

New member
Tomorrow is the big hump (aka OMD) day, Rich!
Yes, it won't be long now! I also have faith in Olympus actually HAVING product to sell reasonably soon, unlike the other 4/3rds company that seems to exist in a perpertual state of product shortage!
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
The silver one looks really nice to me:

Looks nice, like an SLR camera of 1970s-1980s vintage: slim, trim and crisp. I hope it performs to meet the expectations of its OM system heritage. I look forward to seeing one in the flesh when they hit the stores.
 

photoSmart42

New member
You got your wish according to 43rumors... 1/250th sync speed.

I'm wondering what the video improvements are, since rumors indicated that the EM-5's video quality was better than the GH2. Since it's likely using the G3/GX1 sensor (analog), I'm slightly doubtful.
Yes, I did. The Olympus spec sheet confirms it. Now to just decide silver or black. Pre-ordering tomorrow.
 
V

Vivek

Guest
Not only that, it is easier to blacken the white logos than convert the black logo to silver.:D
 

biglouis

Well-known member
I think my m43rd Lieca DG 25/1.4 deserves to be mounted on one of these!

However, I must see some full size samples at high iso, at least 3200 before making a decision.

LouisB
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Saw the official announcement now. Looks very nice, but I am a little concerned with how many buttons and knobs there are on such a small body. It might be somewhat cramped in use. It's the sort of thing that only handling it in person can answer.

Other questions aside, bravo! Looks very nice.
 

Brian Mosley

New member
True, you can never tell how a cameras will feel from the web... Although there's a first introduction video from Olympus, showing the control dials behave similarly to the E-5... which should be very satisfying for rapid control.

Cheers

Brian
 

RichA

New member
I'm a little surprised at the positive reaction to the looks of it, when so much criticism was dumped on the Panosonic G1 for the "faux" bump on the top. Can't get anymore "faux" than the OM bump - no prism in that prism housing!
It would be nice to get a real motor in that bolt-on battery grip, so it would remind us of film moving through this thing.
I admire Pentax's sentiments with the fresh modern K-01 design rather than this Oly OM rehash.

Keith
The G1 was a bad execution. I liked the body and the hump is mostly flash so no problem there, but the "skin" covering the camera did not work out, it peeled from key impact areas in all cases. The GH2 isn't much better, it is basically a slippery camera to hold onto because they got rid of the rubbery skin and replaced it with semi-smooth plastic. The Olympus is traditional with apparently a much better covering. Maybe in future they could put a GPS or a flash in the hump area?
 

photoSmart42

New member
True, you can never tell how a cameras will feel from the web... Although there's a first introduction video from Olympus, showing the control dials behave similarly to the E-5... which should be very satisfying for rapid control.

Cheers

Brian
In some of the videos it looks like with the grip attached it makes for a nice, solid setup.
 

Amin

Active member
For me, the icing on the cake is the report coming from Imaging Resource and elsewhere that this camera has a pleasing, muted shutter sound.

From IR:

When we first tried the E-M5, we noticed that the shutter sound was considerably quieter than the E-PM1 I'd brought along. Then we got out the Sony NEX-7 and put it in electronic first curtain mode, its quietest setting, and the Olympus E-M5 was quieter than that as well. Very impressive. The Olympus E-M5 is likely to be an excellent street camera.
You can hear the shutter sound relative to the volume of the guys voice at ~3:12 in this video.

I feel as though Olympus made this camera specifically for me. I can find absolutely nothing to complain about.
 

Riley

New member
But I don't see this as an issue because the measurements are all equal for all cameras. So if a camera is ranked at 12 stops, and another at 10, I certainly would expect a comparative difference here.
it isnt 'equal'
they do not account for Sony sensor black-level offset in Nikon's for instance, this gives Nikon an advantage in reducing the noise floor, hence artificially widening the DR as they have a noise cut-off.
The same is true to Sony sensor cooked RAWs, they can tell you its happening but they dont correct their data, another advantage to Sony sensors.

measure a K5 or D7000 in IMATEST and they produce around 12 stops of DR not all that far from anyone else.
The same system sees 4/3rds sensors with 11.5 stops DR in RAW that magically gets reduced to 10.5 stops engineering DR or so in DxO,
which is of course - impossible. DxO Im sure are good for some things, this isnt one of them ...

youve been told this time after time and still dont get it
but eventually, like the faked ISO you used to claim one can hope that somehow it penetrates
eventually
 
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