Compatibility P45+ / P25+ with first Hasselblad 500c camera

[kristyansen]

Dear All

I am considering acquiring one of the Phase One P45(+) or P25(+) backs with Hasselblad V mount.

Could anyone please let me know with certainty if these backs are compatible with the Hasselblad 500C camera? The manual (https://captureintegration.com/download/P+_Series_Reference_Manual.pdf) does not mention it explicitly on page 60 (maybe because you cannot change the focusing screen like explained on page 61, operation available only later, but maybe there are other mechanical or optical reasons, too, to know before making a purchase).

Also one side question - why do you think the price on the used market of these backs for the Hasselblad V mount is much higher than the price of the same backs for the Hasselblad H mount?

Thank you in advance for your input
Cristian


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https://www.cristian-duda.com

 

[darr]

The only difference between the 500C and the 500CM (the next generation after the 500C) is that the user cannot change the focusing screen in the 500C, but a trained Hasselblad technician can. I know this because I had it done many years ago. Do not attempt to do this unless you understand what you are doing, as the focus will be screwed up if not done correctly.

Focusing poses a significant challenge when using a digital back on an older mechanical camera such as the Hasselblad. The tolerance for the plane of focus differs slightly between film and digital sensors, with film being more forgiving and digital sensors less so. Due to the presence of moving parts in mechanical cameras, it's common for the mirror, responsible for reflecting the image onto the focusing screen, to become slightly misaligned for accurate focusing on the digital sensor's surface. The focusing process involves the mirror, followed by what the focusing screen projects to your eye for focusing on the digital sensor. Any deviation along this path can lead to focusing errors.

The introduction of Live View with digital backs effectively addressed this focusing issue. When using Live View, focusing occurs directly between the digital sensor and the lens, bypassing any concerns related to the mirror's alignment. Therefore, even if your mirror is slightly misaligned, it becomes irrelevant when focusing through Live View because Live View looks through the lens.

Is it possible to use a P45 with a Hasselblad 500C camera?
Yes, you can, provided the back has a V mount, appropriate cables, and the flash sync on your lenses is compatible with the connection.
Will you achieve sharp results? That largely hinges on the factors mentioned above, as the P45/P45+ does not have Live View.

I've used a P45 with a Mamiya RZ IID and technical cameras.
Additionally, I've owned a Hasselblad CFV I 50c in the past and currently have a CFV II 50c.
The shooting experience between the P45 and a Live View-equipped digital back is significantly different.

Based on my previous experiences with the P45, I wouldn't pursue that option.
If you have the opportunity to try it out before making a purchase, I recommend doing so.
You can also utilize the Hasselblad ground glass designed for the SWC with a V series camera to verify focus via the lens.
However, this might become cumbersome if you don't have sufficient time to focus meticulously.

Best to you,
Darr

 

[Steve Hendrix]

Hi Cristian -

Any Phase One digital back that has a "V" monikor after the model number, like P45+ V, IQ260 V, etc. will be compatible with all 5xx series Hasselblad bodies.

You may find the pricing a bit higher on V - based digital backs, just because of the scarcity of them (and the passion of some Hasselblad V series users), as Phase One stopped offering their digital backs in Hasselblad V mounts some years back (the last being the IQ380).

You could also consider the Hasselblad 907x/CFV 50c II or the just released 907x/CFV 100c.

One important difference between a Phase One digital back and a Hasselblad digital back for Hasselblad V system is that the Phase One digital backs will require a sync cable from the lens to the digital back, but they do have a 2 sided mount, which allows you to rotate the sensor from horizontal to vertical, while the Hasselblad is cable free, but to shoot with the sensor in vertical orientation, the entire camera would need to rotate.

There are of course other differences, the user interface, the compatible raw editing software, etc.

A 907x/CFV 50c II or 907x/CFV 100c may be a bit pricier than a legacy Phase One digital back, but they have some modern advantages and ... they're pretty available!


Steve Hendrix/CI

 

[itsdoable]

I currently use a P25 and a P65+ on a 500c. Works great.

I prefer it over my 500cx because:

- the 500c has a body x-sync (for photomicrography) which you can use to trigger the back - which means you don't have to reconnect the sync cord when you change lenses. Just check that yours is still wired, a lot of service tech's removed the internal wires to make assembly easier, as they were often not used.

- it's easier to calibrate the screen with the sensor on the 500c (you have to pull the body from the shell to do that on the 500cm)

I have an acute matte screen installed in my 500c

 

[kristyansen]

Dear all,

this was my first post on this forum, and I want to thank you for the quality of the answers.

I understand now that focusing may be difficult but also that there may be a chance though. However I must add that digital costs of Hasselblad V backs is quite prohibitive that is why I was aiming for the PhaseOne P(+) series.

I would like to slightly extend the question in its two dimensions - camera body and camera back.

- Camera body: I am also considering a Hasselblad H2 camera with a Hase One P(+) back. Could the focus plane misalignment still be an issue?

- Digital back with live view: on the 500 series, if using a digital back with live view (especially a non Hasselblad one, like the Phase One P(+)), can live view really work with the mirror up? For example in the P+ manual it says that the digital back should not be „mounted„ with the mirror up, but it was not clear to me if this also meant „operated“ with the mirror up.

Thank you for your thoughts
Cristian

 

[darr]

Welcome to getDPI, Cristian.

I cannot answer your "H" questions as I never went that route.
I have stayed with the 'V' system well into digital (I still shoot 501cm and 503cx) and added a 907x 50c.
For Live View to work in a 'V' body, set the camera in 'B' mode, and the mirror must be up so the sensor can see through the lens.
You must keep the lens shutter open, usually with a locking shutter release cable.
Then, you release 'B' mode and wind the film advance to get ready to shoot.
It's clunky but doable.

Darr

 

[kristyansen]

Dear all,

One question to all those using digital backs on the 500c - are you using the original lenses, and, if so, do you think the old lens quality becomes a negative in the results obtained on a high resolution digital sensor - e.g. very unsharp or color casts, etc.?

I have the original Zeiss Planar 80/2.8 on my 500c and do not intend to acquire new lenses for now - I would not want to make a digital back acquisition for studio / portraits and experience disappointment. I like lenses with some character, but I do not like eg strange color casts on extremities, which are hard to correct.

What lenses are you getting best results with?

Thank you for sharing your thoughts / experiences.

Kind regards,
Cristian

 

[FloatingLens]

I have yet to experience color cast issues with the existing V lenses on a 500 body and digital back. There is ample distance between the flange and the sensor, hence color is uniform.

 

[Hasslebad]

I haven’t had any issues with the lenses I use which are the 60, 100 and 120. I recently have been using the 40 but haven’t used that with the digital back as much. I can let you know when I shoot with that more using the digital back.

 

[kristyansen]

Dear all,
I have taken the plunge and acquired a Phase One P45 (non plus) technical back for my Hasselblad 500C.
The focusing works pretty accurately. I have the original dark(er) matte focusing screen of the 500c screen which I am to have changed to a more transparent one by a specialists.
I was also able to map some dead pixels / lines using a piece of software from GitHub.
All in all quite an interesting set-up I am quite keen to put to more usage in real portrait scenarios.
Thanks all for the advice!
Cristian