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X1D Firmware 1.17.2: Resizeable AF points AND Electronic Shutter!

jduncan

Member
For me, being able to resize the AF points is huge. Yes, I'd love to have a joystick to move the focus point around, but it is what it is. Having 2mm AF points makes AF much more precise and more like the other DSLR and mirrorless cameras I've used (or still use).

The electronic shutter is an unexpected bonus. It removes the FUD factor from using long lenses, either hand-held or from a tripod.

Thumbs up for this update. :thumbup:

Joe

Could not agree more.
It's a shame that they did not put any mechanisms to move the Phocus points.
I agree that the solution they find is creative, and it does work, but it's less than ideal.
Progress continues, I am eager to see the X2D-100 that should come based on Sony's sensor roadmap:https://www.dpreview.com/news/11719...ap-includes-150mp-medium-format-chip-for-2018

In the meanwhile I agree: being able to resize the AF points is huge.

Best regards,
 

PeterA

Well-known member
Ming Thein has commented on his site ... looks like the E shutter will work silently with
non XCD lenses ...

He has tested a number of Nikon mount lenses and has alluded to a potential commercial
adapter for Nikon to X1D appearing 'soon'.

Looks like the Otus 85 is the keeper out of the group.

And so an adapter for X1D to a tech cam should be possible.

Good news.

Bob
Thanks for the info Bob - I will definitely be buying such an adapter if it comes out.
 
The electronic shutter itself is silent, by definition. It's electronic, not mechanical. The sound that you're hearing is the aperture closing and reopening after exposure. You can test this by using Mq mode. In that mode, with the aperture set to shooting aperture, the camera is silent. No shutter sound. Period. That is true for both native lenses and for HC and HCD lenses using the X-H adapter. With after-market adapters made by other companies (aka "dumb adapters") where the aperture is set using the aperture ring on the lens, the camera will be silent when using the electronic shutter mode.

Joe
Does this make any difference in term of noise? The bottom line is that to have a totally silent shoot you need to use a non native lens (with adapter) or to shoot blind using the Mq mode.
 

chrismuc

Member
the readout time of the electronic shutter varies a lot depending on the camera (and sensor size and generation)
therefore it's universal usage also relies a lot on that

some samples:

Screen Shot 2017-08-26 at 08.37.44.jpg
 

tjv

Active member
I wonder what the chances are of Hasselblad releasing an interim update for the X1d, like say an X1d.2, with focus selector joystick. Seems like the number one drawback of the camera now when I compare it to the competition and IMHO it was a pretty big oversight in the design.
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
I realize that I am suspect as I have the camera and have resolved most of the haptic issues.

Two ways to pick the focus ... scroll wheels ... a bit slow. Touch screen is much faster than any joystick.

It works ... either conform to the programming and design or buy a GFX ....

Hard for me to imagine that this is a deal breaker.

Just sayin' ...

Bob
 

tjv

Active member
I'm "just sayin'" that a selector joystick would make for a faster shooting experience, especially for reportage type work without a tripod. What's wrong with wondering if they'll include one in the next iteration? I like the X1d, especially the grip and menus. I want one, but the focus selector joystick is one feature I and a lot of people seem to miss as the design sits.

In the mean time, I have purchased a GFX and four lenses for work. After four months I've yet to use it for anything serious – it's a tool for many people to use and has proved to be a good purchase so far – because I don't like the ergonomics, complex menu systems or rather unwieldily lenses (it's but a personal opinion, of course.) If the X1d had of had ES and the now smaller focus points at the time we bought the GFX, we might have gone the Hasselblad way instead. Certainly if I was buying for myself, I woudn't even contemplate the GFX. For what's important to me, overall the X1d is just a much better designed camera. It seems many people here feel the same way.

One can always conform to the programming and design as you say – I am afterall something of a masochist choosing to focus a 60mpx back without useable live view on a Linhof Techno GG – but I'm quite interested in feeding back to Hasselblad things they might do to develop the system going forward. This is my subjective opinion and I've relayed it all back to Hasselblad through my dealer.

In the meantime, I will continue to lust after buying an X1d regardless.

I realize that I am suspect as I have the camera and have resolved most of the haptic issues.

Two ways to pick the focus ... scroll wheels ... a bit slow. Touch screen is much faster than any joystick.

It works ... either conform to the programming and design or buy a GFX ....

Hard for me to imagine that this is a deal breaker.

Just sayin' ...

Bob
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
One can always conform to the programming and design as you say – I am afterall something of a masochist choosing to focus a 60mpx back without useable live view on a Linhof Techno GG – but I'm quite interested in feeding back to Hasselblad things they might do to develop the system going forward. This is my subjective opinion and I've relayed it all back to Hasselblad through my dealer.
I get it ... for a year and a half I used an Alpa TC with a H3D 39 II back ... had to power it off of a FW800 hub and external battery the size of a paperback book. No live view ... shoot and pray, that you might have come close enough to the focus plane of interest.

So for me the X1D is generations ahead of the past experiences. I have used joysticks ... and yes if you have to hurry the process they might be more to your liking. But again the touch screen pick of a focus point is so fast and accurate that
I doubt Hasselblad will want to change the design. Personally I am not in favor of touch screens and will go to whatever extreme to avoid their use ... so the scroll wheels work when I need to do an off center focus. But the touch screen is much faster and
has immediate feedback.

The comment just saying' is my editorial on everyone looking for their perfect dream of a camera ... if there is enough traffic on the internet ... it will drive the manufacturer to change a design. I am not convinced that is necessarily an impetus that the designers
will embrace. Might as well admit they were wrong and Fuji nailed it.

I see the X1D as a far development of the Leica T or cell phone programming implementation of a visual design interface. If you watch the video from Ming Thein ... it is all about the back of the camera and the touch screen. Of interest to me is that he
has had a stated preference for optical finders and seems to favor the H6D cameras for most of his work. In my short time with the camera ... the great advantage is the ability to focus at 100% magnification and nail the narrow plane of focus. But my
personal preference would be for a more Leica M feel and Leica Q speed. However the output is far above the somewhat stilted haptics that one has to work with ... and that is worth the effort.

I imagine that I can move to a focus point with the scroll wheels about 90% as fast as I could with a joystick ... and with time might improve on that differential. So with practice it may be less of an issue.

My doubts center on whether the design team at Hasselblad will make a change that would be an admission that their view for the future of mirrorless MF cameras was mistaken. But perhaps they will surprise us all.

Bob
 

CAMBOUSA

Member
Both tcdeveau and Steve from Capture Integration have independently reached out to me regarding an official Cambo solution.

While I cannot comment officially on anything right now, I assure you all that I have passed along your excitement to the R&D team and am waiting patiently for a possible solution.

IF/WHEN anything comes from it, you guys will be the first to know.
I have to apologize for being intentionally vague about this, but I will say that I heard some news this morning that may make a few people happy.

I'll give all the official details when the time comes.
 

tashley

Subscriber Member
Minority report: since updating, my sometimes flakey control wheels (especially the rear one, used to control exposure compensation) have mostly lost contact with reality and in addition, though my memory cards are above spec but used to occasionally give a 'card too slow' error, now it happens like, all the frickin' time and worse, the warning message crops up in an undismissible way in the VF but not for a while on the screen, from whence it is dismissible.

So all in all, for me, a retrograde step. There's no point having a smaller AF point if the camera keeps playing like it's its first time on stage....
 

Eli

New member
Minority report: since updating, my sometimes flakey control wheels (especially the rear one, used to control exposure compensation) have mostly lost contact with reality and in addition, though my memory cards are above spec but used to occasionally give a 'card too slow' error, now it happens like, all the frickin' time and worse, the warning message crops up in an undismissible way in the VF but not for a while on the screen, from whence it is dismissible.

So all in all, for me, a retrograde step. There's no point having a smaller AF point if the camera keeps playing like it's its first time on stage....
I am sorry you are having such troubles. However, with all due respect, until more people report similar symptoms, I wonder if it's "correlation does not always equal causation," kind of thing... in the few days since the upgrade, I have yet to experience what you describe... the upgrade, for me, has been solid.

Eli
 

docmoore

Subscriber and Workshop Member
Minority report: since updating, my sometimes flakey control wheels (especially the rear one, used to control exposure compensation) have mostly lost contact with reality and in addition, though my memory cards are above spec but used to occasionally give a 'card too slow' error, now it happens like, all the frickin' time and worse, the warning message crops up in an undismissible way in the VF but not for a while on the screen, from whence it is dismissible.

So all in all, for me, a retrograde step. There's no point having a smaller AF point if the camera keeps playing like it's its first time on stage....
Time to send it to the mother ship for a replacement of the control wheels ... I assume this is a totally different issue and can be resolved very quickly ... looking at the responses of those who needed the repair.

Probably not related to the FW update ... but an impetus to have them repair your baby.

Bob
 

BANKER1

Member
Minority report: since updating, my sometimes flakey control wheels (especially the rear one, used to control exposure compensation) have mostly lost contact with reality and in addition, though my memory cards are above spec but used to occasionally give a 'card too slow' error, now it happens like, all the frickin' time and worse, the warning message crops up in an undismissible way in the VF but not for a while on the screen, from whence it is dismissible.

So all in all, for me, a retrograde step. There's no point having a smaller AF point if the camera keeps playing like it's its first time on stage....
My front and rear control wheels went flaky, so I had to send my X1D in for repair. The only "card too slow" message was when I used an ancient SD card to update the camera firmware. The newest firmware was added after it returned from the repair. My 2 SanDisk 128GB Extreme PRO UHS-1 SDXC cards have worked flawlessly so far. Knock on wood!

Greg
 
In general, my camera is much more stable than at the time when I got it. 1.17.2 should have been version 1.0.

What I observed with the new smaller AF-points (2mm) is that there are more focus errors than before with the 4mm points. Sometimes totally out of focus with a green square. This occurs mostly but not always in relative low-light situations (probably the AF system has a hard time to find something with enough contrast within the small square). Seems that this feature needs some more tweaks to be more reliable.

My control wheels (still) work fine, but the number of user reports with similar problems seems to increase ... not good ....
 

tcdeveau

Well-known member
My wheels started getting flaky two firmware updates ago. I'm finally sending mine in to get fixed this week as I will practically have no time for photography the next couple weeks
 

hcubell

Active member
Time to send it to the mother ship for a replacement of the control wheels ... I assume this is a totally different issue and can be resolved very quickly ... looking at the responses of those who needed the repair.

Probably not related to the FW update ... but an impetus to have them repair your baby.

Bob
I agree, Tim. Time to do it. Hasselblad is apparently turning the control wheel repair around very quickly. If the issues you are experiencing are not control wheel related, I would think Hasselblad should just replace your camera at this point. It just can't be an issue of the firmware, as too many of us are NOT having problems, even with the most recent firmware updates.
 
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mkerouac

Member
I wonder what the chances are of Hasselblad releasing an interim update for the X1d, like say an X1d.2, with focus selector joystick. Seems like the number one drawback of the camera now when I compare it to the competition and IMHO it was a pretty big oversight in the design.

I totally respect your desire to have the joystick and I agree that it would make choosing focus points faster. But I don't think it was a design oversight. Despite its portability and small size, the X1D was not designed to be a volume shooter or a "speed" of use camera. It's medium format, you are supposed to slow down when using the X1D. There is plenty of time to bring up the rear screen and tap a focus point Remember the H series camera's have a center focus point and that's it. HB looked at the multi points on the X1D as a big change. I'm sure some of the designers even considered staying with 1 focus point. This is not a DSLR and I hope it doesn't morph into one. I love the simplicity. It's kind of old school photography. Our increasing desire and even dependency to have technology take the photos for us, is getting a bit troubling to me. The camera can help you take great photos, but the photographer still should be the one making great photos.
 

pflower

Member
Before updating to the most recent firmware I have had no problems with either of the dials. But after updating to 1.17.2 my front dial has started to behave erratically. Will not change aperture smoothly, sometimes gets stuck on an aperture or actually changes it in the opposite direction to that expected. Same thing with moving the focus points. I cannot use the front dial to move the point all the way to the end of a row - 4 or 5 points maximum before it either gets stuck or goes backwards. No problems with the back dial though. I have raised a query with Hasselblad UK support so will see what they say.



Minority report: since updating, my sometimes flakey control wheels (especially the rear one, used to control exposure compensation) have mostly lost contact with reality and in addition, though my memory cards are above spec but used to occasionally give a 'card too slow' error, now it happens like, all the frickin' time and worse, the warning message crops up in an undismissible way in the VF but not for a while on the screen, from whence it is dismissible.

So all in all, for me, a retrograde step. There's no point having a smaller AF point if the camera keeps playing like it's its first time on stage....
 

tashley

Subscriber Member
Pursuant to the comments here (for which many thanks) I called Hassy UK this morning. They told me to raise a ticket online and when I did I got a call within seconds, literally, to arrange a pickup. The camera has now been collected (less than four hours after my first call!) and they think they can get it back to me fixed before my trip starting next weekend. That's pretty cool!
 

reds

New member
Looking forward to updating and trying out the new focus points option. Also curious to see what/when an f-mount adapter would bring for Otus glass.

I have one more wish for firmware - if the X1D could remember the focus point you used when switching from portrait to landscape orientation (like Nikon implemented). it's extremely handy!
 
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