Site Sponsors
Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: IR photography with Phase One backs

  1. #1
    mikeinlondon
    Guest

    IR photography with Phase One backs

    Been keen IR photographer for a while now, using my converted Olympus E3, which is good....

    I own a P25+ and hanker after the quality of that for my IR photography so was looking at getting a second hand P20/21 (been looking for a while now but never seen one!) to have converted to IR only.

    So has anyone done this and does it work ok? Any Focus problems? Did you get the IR filter put on the back (as P1 support tells me is possible) or did you have it replaced with the plain optical glass and use an IR filter on the lens?

    Wondering also if I went down the route of getting the back converted to IR only with optical glass, can you still get normal wavelength light recordings ok by using an IR blocking filter on the lens?

    Love to hear your views

    Tried an R72 on my P25+ but it didnt really work well!

    Attached is a low res sample of a stitched E3 shot

    Mike

  2. #2
    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Lindenberg im Allgäu
    Posts
    1,294
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    12

    Re: IR photography with Phase One backs

    Mike

    there is a very reliable and knowledgeable company here in Germany, which have converted my 5DMK2 perfectly (with sensorcleaning and newest firmware all intact):

    http://www.optik-makario.de/ they are located in Cologne.

    I talked to them recently about doing such an MF conversion and this shall not be a problem. The filter(s) will be replaced by clear glass with the exact same diffraction index, Makario even delivers a perfectly matched Cyan green, UV- or IR-pass Filter for sizes up to 86 mm (I have these for our 4/40mm Zeiss Superrotators) and the results are astounding.

    hope this helps - Greetings from Munich
    Stefan

  3. #3
    mikeinlondon
    Guest

    Re: IR photography with Phase One backs

    Quote Originally Posted by Stefan Steib View Post
    Mike

    there is a very reliable and knowledgeable company here in Germany, which have converted my 5DMK2 perfectly (with sensorcleaning and newest firmware all intact):

    http://www.optik-makario.de/ they are located in Cologne.

    I talked to them recently about doing such an MF conversion and this shall not be a problem. The filter(s) will be replaced by clear glass with the exact same diffraction index, Makario even delivers a perfectly matched Cyan green, UV- or IR-pass Filter for sizes up to 86 mm (I have these for our 4/40mm Zeiss Superrotators) and the results are astounding.

    hope this helps - Greetings from Munich
    Stefan
    Interesting!

    I believe the P1 back need recalibrating for focus after such conversion though

    can they do that too?

    Mike

  4. #4
    Workshop Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    3,274
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    7

    Re: IR photography with Phase One backs

    We can provide a variety of IR modified phase one backs. Generally the price is about $3k higher than a similar non IR back.

    The position of the sensor is adjusted for an average lens. There is some variation from lens to lens on how differently focused the near-IR and IR is from visible.

    I suggest a P21+ or P25+ if you're on a budget rather than a P30+. The reason is that an IR digital back is almost sure to take you down the road of a tech camera at some point. With an IR back the IR-block filter is removed and you still need an IR-pass visible-block filter to do true IR. The problem with that of course is the IR-pass visible-block filter will make it impossible to see through a traditional SLR! A tech camera is already a rangefinder system (it does not use a through-the-lens viewfinder) and is equally well suited to shoot IR as visible.

    Infrared P21
    http://www.captureintegration.com/20...ack-and-white/

    Infrared P45
    http://www.captureintegration.com/2008/06/09/p45-ir/

    Infrared P45 (filter comparison - near bottom of page)
    http://www.captureintegration.com/tests/phase-one/

    I've also shot a modified 5D (mark 1), 20D, unmodified (but somewhat conducive) Nikon D1, Olympus E-20, Canon a620, G10 as well as Macopho (now called/sold-as Efke) 820IR and 820IR Aura films and Ilford SFX film in 120 format. None of it came anywhere even close to the three Phase One IR backs I've had the pleasure of shooting with.

    So bottom line: while an Achromatic is, by design, in a league of its own, the P+ backs modified for IR are well worth your look and are the best IR devices I've ever used (other than the Achromatic).

    Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
    __________________

    Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
    Phase One Partner of the Year
    Leaf, Leica, Cambo, Arca Swiss, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Broncolor, Eizo & More

    National: 877.217.9870 *| *Cell: 740.707.2183
    Newsletter | RSS Feed
    Buy Capture One 6 at 10% off

  5. #5
    Senior Member Stefan Steib's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Lindenberg im Allgäu
    Posts
    1,294
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    12

    Re: IR photography with Phase One backs

    Hi Doug

    I agree- the image quality of the Achromatic P45+ is unreached.

    But there is one advantage of the Canon which is right now unmatched by (most- well sort of) MF´s- it´s the Video Live View.

    With this you can focus and completely control your actual image, especially when you use the filters which are black for visible light.
    And if you use IR Lenses like the Zeiss 1,4/85mm this has a very strong focus shift when closing the aperture. Without Life view it can be quite demanding to get this cought right.

    It may be interesting though to convert a new Phase IQ 180........;-)))

  6. #6
    mikeinlondon
    Guest

    Re: IR photography with Phase One backs

    Hi Doug

    Thanks for the reply and the samples.... the first P1 IR samples I have seen.

    One thing puzzles me though, my current IR camera, the E3, is converted to IR by having its Ir cut filter on the sensor replaced with an R72 equivalent filter thus giving me normal viewing through the lens and normal shutter speeds of course. Have you ever seen this done on a P1 back? Whenever i see people mentioning IR on P1 its always just replacing the IR cut filter on the sensor with optical glass, and still using an opaque IR filter on the lens. Why not just mount an IR filter on the sensor like my E3?

    I dont really want to go down the tech camera route as I already have a P1 camera and 3 lenses and am happy with that set up so putting the IR filter direct on the sensor makes sense to me

    Tech support (US) tell me this is possible as i raised a support case for it.

    I think I am looking at a P20/21 in reality as it wont get a huge amount of use compared to the cost... if only I could justify an Achromatic!

    Do you have any second hand bodies for sale in Mamiya fit?

    Mike

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Zug/Zurich (Switzerland), Dubai, Sydney
    Posts
    334
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: IR photography with Phase One backs

    I have shot quite a lot with the Achromatic, both with visible light and also infra red. This sensor has incredibly wide spectral sensitivity ranging from UV to IR. It is also a monochromatic sensor, so there is no Bayer pattern interference. The tonality is simply unmatched by any of the converted cameras. I just wish I could build enough of a business case around one the get the Finance Minister, Mrs.Siebel, to approve the purchase. Hmmm
    If you'd like to see some pics, have a look at the shots of the girl in the black water that I shot in my swimming pool. They are on my ModelMayhem profile, Siebel Dubai
    http://www.modelmayhem.com/1376600

    Cheers,
    Siebel
    "In the end, it's all about the pictures"
    www.bryansiebel.com

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •