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Thread: Nikon D90 is here

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Nikon D90 is here

    From Nikon itself here is the link to the new D90. It has video

    http://www.nikonusa.com/Find-Your-Ni...25446/D90.html
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Key features

    12.3-megapixel DX-format CMOS imaging sensor: Coupled with Nikon's EXPEED image processing technologies and NIKKOR optics, breathtaking image fidelity is assured.
    Continuous shooting as fast as 4.5 frames-per-second: Combined with fast 0.15ms power-up and split-second 65ms shooting lag, dramatic action and decisive moments are captured easily.
    D-Movie Mode—Cinematic 24fps HD with sound: Record cinematic-quality movie clips at up to 720p HD (1280 x 720 pixels) in Motion JPEG format, enhanced by NIKKOR interchangeable lens quality and versatility.
    Low noise ISO sensitivity from 200 to 3200: High signal-to-noise components and design deliver exceptional performance, even at high ISO setting.
    3-inch super-density 920,000-dot color LCD monitor: High resolution, 170-degree wide-angle viewing guarantees confident image review and movie playback.
    Built-in image sensor cleaning: Effective 4-frequency, ultrasonic sensor cleaning frees image degrading dust particles from the sensor's optical low pass filter.
    11-point AF system with Face Priority: Consistently fast and accurate autofocus, reinforced by the Nikon Scene Recognition System, delivers razor sharpness in a wide variety of conditions.
    One-button Live View: Easy to use Live View activates access to 3 contrast detection focus modes including Face Priority AF.
    Nikon 3D Color Matrix Metering II with Scene Recognition System: Nikon's renowned 420-pixel RGB 3D Color Matrix Metering II, teamed with the exclusive Scene Recognition System, evaluates images, referencing an on-board database of over 30,000 photographic scenes, for unmatched exposure accuracy.
    Comprehensive exposure control: Five advanced scene modes plus Program Auto, Shutter Priority, Aperture Priority and Manual.
    Auto Active D-Lighting: Selectable and Automatic, Active D-Lighting optimizes details within shadows and highlights, taming high-contrast situations in real time.
    Durable, high precision shutter: Testing to over 100,000 cycles assures shutter life and accuracy.
    In-Camera Image Editing: Creative freedom stems from exclusive in-camera image editing, featuring Fisheye effect, Straighten and Distortion Control as well as D-Lighting, Red-eye Reduction, Image Overlay, Monochrome and more.
    GPS geo-tagging: GP-1 GPS unit (optional) provides automatic real-time geo-tagging.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Subscriber Member Jorgen Udvang's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    That looks like a very cool camera. I think I want one

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    Senior Member Joan's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Wow, movies on a DSLR, and that lovely LCD from the D300. Sure sounds fab, I'll look forward to the reviews.
    Regards,
    Joan

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Big screen, 12.3Mp, Commander flash, light and small[ish] body, all for [UK price] £700 inc. VAT.

    Extraordinary!

    Now where's that rangefinder................... ?

    ............ Chris

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    While the movies thing is a first differentiating step for DSLRs, it is not quite up to snuf on what it could be. It is only 720p, which is not bad, but that is sort of minimum for HD. It is 24fps rather than 30fps which would be a much smoother standard. It does not have auto WB, nor AF or AF tracking, both things that are sort of critical for capturing things that move and into differing light also. Its audio is only mono, with no stereo or plugs. None of these are deal killers for most, but they are shortcomings that folks used to shooting movies would miss for sure. On the big plus side, being able to use a wide variety of lenses that would normally be beyond reach for most movie cameras is nice. Being able to shoot with ultrawide angle lenses, or obtain very shallow DOF with nice optics for a movie could provide some real creative platform for aspiring movie makers that want to experiment with things. And the fact the sensor is huge compared to most DV cameras only underscores how good some of the clips could be from folks.

    If you watch the movie clip posted on the site, you will get a pretty good idea of how good the video capture is, as well as how lackluster the audio is. Nice to see this first step, but Nikon could have added a bit more to get something that lesser digicams now provide routinely. The tracking AF will be a bit more challenging, as most DSLR lenses were not designed for that kind of use, though all the pieces are in place to accommodate it.

    On balance, nice to see this innovation, and hope future deployment fixes some of the video shortcomings.

    LJ

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    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Wait for the N900? :-)
    At this rate, it should show up in about six weeks.
    -bob
    Last edited by Bob; 27th August 2008 at 17:18.

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    The video will probably have superb quality, up to professional standards, but if you can't record sound to this quality, then it's more or less useless for serious film work. Or can you attach a microphone?

    If not, it's a bit of a gimmick. Not a bad gimmick. If it can be done, why not do it?

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    Senior Member Joan's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    I've never used the video mode on any of my cameras, but it does seem to have some cool possibilities depending on which lens(es) one might choose.

    More importantly, if the IQ is equal to the D300 in a much smaller package, I think I could learn to love this thing. I wonder if they'll ever be able to stuff a FF sensor into the D80/90 size cameras ...
    Regards,
    Joan

  10. #10
    Oxide Blu
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    What LJ hit on ... "D-Movie Mode—Cinematic 24fps HD" causes a little concern. I can see 25fps (Asia) and 30fps (US), but "cinematic 24fps" suggests some weird-assed Nikon-only software interface is probably to sit between your N90 movie and your TV/computer display. I hope I'm wrong, hoping this isn't another Nikon NEF type of proprietary format for movies.

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Well lots of folks do like to shoot video clips, so there is a market but I agree it will need sound.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Think of it as really fast fps stills... ;>

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxide Blu View Post
    What LJ hit on ... "D-Movie Mode—Cinematic 24fps HD" causes a little concern. I can see 25fps (Asia) and 30fps (US), but "cinematic 24fps" suggests some weird-assed Nikon-only software interface is probably to sit between your N90 movie and your TV/computer display. I hope I'm wrong, hoping this isn't another Nikon NEF type of proprietary format for movies.
    The 24 fps is actually a "standard" for the movie industry, hence the preface "Cinematic". Many, if not most theater movies are shot and projected at 24 fps, but 30 fps (actually 29.97 fps) has been the "standard" in the US at least for most video and digital video recording and play devices. The 24 fps will have more of a movie film look, but there is a difference in appearance between it and 30 fps, the latter being more smooth in frame to frame appearance.

    So, it is not something special to Nikon, and should not be a problem for most folks. The 30 fps would have been preferred, but that starts to require a bit more throughput and storage capacity.

    LJ

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by sizifo View Post
    The video will probably have superb quality, up to professional standards, but if you can't record sound to this quality, then it's more or less useless for serious film work. Or can you attach a microphone?

    If not, it's a bit of a gimmick. Not a bad gimmick. If it can be done, why not do it?
    The video does look good, and at "cinematic" quality with the slower frame rate. Most folks will not complain about that. The sound is a different issue. Unless one is going to take along a separate digital stereo recorder with microphones, and then sync the audio with video in post, not much else one can do. (That starts to become more of a production than just nice and easy capture.) From the specs, there are no plugs or abilities to add stereo to the D90 capture in the camera. The mono mic and recording is not terrible, but it definitely appears to be a shortcoming compared to how good the images look in the movie capture. Sort of like looking at the world through a big, clean picture window, but hearing that world through the device at the ticket window at the theater. (Maybe not the most accurate analogy, but you get the point.) This should not keep enterprising movie makers from doing their own audio tracks as production work, but for most folks just wanting to capture a clip, it is going to sound flat for sure.

    Considering they even put HDMI output jacks on to port things to a big screen and HD set-up in something like a home theater, the sound is going to be boring in mono, especially for folks used to surround or good stereo. In my opinion, this may detract from how good the video capture looks. This is an entry level DSLR that is incorporating the newer tech, so that is still good. Stereo would have required placing another mic on the camera, or at least a jack for accessory mic, plus using more storage capacity for the stereo signal in the recording. Cutting corners in little places, but on things that video folks will notice quickly.

    LJ

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    How far is the microphone supposed to reach to pick up the sound?I assume a lot of people using this will be the same people with an 18-200mm lens on the camera and for a good chunk of that zoom range won't you be out of range to pick up decent sound? Also, when I think of iMovie type program don't people tend to music anyway?

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Terry,
    I am not a video/audio buff, so cannot answer your questions with anything other than limited background knowledge and thoughts. I agree that distance is going to be the first issue, but nothing folks are not now wrestling with on HD video cameras. If you are zooming and what to capture the sounds of the distant subject, you need a directional mic and proper recording gear.

    This is why I see the D90's video as nothing more than a "nice to have", but not for serious use. This is really too bad, as the video quality will be quite good. And, as you suggest, if folks just dump in music for an audio track, that will be fine. However, many folks shoot video clips to capture both the sight and sounds of the moment, like comments, laughter, conversations, etc. That starts to get more into having the need for better audio/video gear to do movie making. The D90 capture to me will be really nice for higher resolution and creative touch use, where you add whatever audio you want, as the captured audio ain't gonna wow folks ;-)

    Not trying to trash a device and features that are not even on the market yet. Just putting some perspective into things to help temper expectations a bit. If you buy a D90 and expect to shoot stunning movies, you will probably be disappointed. If you buy a D90 and want to use one aspect of its creative capabilities for capturing nice video clips with long lenses, shallow DOF, etc., and then using your own audio and comp, you may be very happy with those results. This D90 is not a video camera first.....that is the add-on to help differentiate it a bit more, I think.

    LJ

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by LJL View Post

    This D90 is not a video camera first.....that is the add-on to help differentiate it a bit more, I think.

    LJ
    I think that I was trying to say precisely the same thing as you. Gimmick was not the best word to use. Just meant that, optically, it should be of professional quality. But filmmakers want quality sound integrated, or at least ports for mics. I guess you can always record sound separately, and then patch it later.

    For casual use, imovie stuff, it should be great.

  18. #18
    rexyinc
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by sizifo View Post
    I think that I was trying to say precisely the same thing as you. Gimmick was not the best word to use. Just meant that, optically, it should be of professional quality. But filmmakers want quality sound integrated, or at least ports for mics. I guess you can always record sound separately, and then patch it later.

    For casual use, imovie stuff, it should be great.

    err actually no, film makers always use separate sound recording rigs- those mics on booms certainly do not go into the video cameras mic inputs lol..

    Guess we are going to see a ton of non-facts from non-film makers on the boards as most here are still shooters, not film makers.

    Every production I've ever been on, from small indy to commercial tv film crews - no one has ever tried to get the video to capture the audio also. it just doesn't happen. Even the baby crews of two are use=ing minidiscs with remote mics on the shirts for commentary and fluffy mics on booms that the grip boys hold over their heads on the larger crews..

    I can see a lot of ipod with ext/wireless high quality stereo mics being sold to D90 users in the very near future, me included.

    Autofocus is a non-issue to film/indy guys also, very few would use it apart from wedding shooters I guess.. and 5min clips arn't a issue either to anyone. ie: watch a movie, any movie, how often do you see the camera just sit there with the same POV for more then a few seconds? it just doesn't happen.

    Interesting times indeed.. the future of Dslr's just got amp'd - and expect a ton of stock site's adding HD video clips to their photo stock libraries for sale.

    Indy guys are going to see this as a cheap RED rig, with the DOF, high iso and nikon glass, 24f 720p is perfect, they are going to have a ball with it.

    Tony.

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by rexyinc View Post
    err actually no, film makers always use separate sound recording rigs- those mics on booms certainly do not go into the video cameras mic inputs lol..

    Guess we are going to see a ton of non-facts from non-film makers on the boards as most here are still shooters, not film makers.

    Every production I've ever been on, from small indy to commercial tv film crews - no one has ever tried to get the video to capture the audio also. it just doesn't happen. Even the baby crews of two are use=ing minidiscs with remote mics on the shirts for commentary and fluffy mics on booms that the grip boys hold over their heads on the larger crews..

    I can see a lot of ipod with ext/wireless high quality stereo mics being sold to D90 users in the very near future, me included.

    Autofocus is a non-issue to film/indy guys also, very few would use it apart from wedding shooters I guess.. and 5min clips arn't a issue either to anyone. ie: watch a movie, any movie, how often do you see the camera just sit there with the same POV for more then a few seconds? it just doesn't happen.

    Interesting times indeed.. the future of Dslr's just got amp'd - and expect a ton of stock site's adding HD video clips to their photo stock libraries for sale.

    Indy guys are going to see this as a cheap RED rig, with the DOF, high iso and nikon glass, 24f 720p is perfect, they are going to have a ball with it.

    Tony.

    Ah. OK. Obviously I don't know much about filmmaking, and I did think mics were connected to the camera . I was just thinking, this is almost useful for a serious filmmaking, but has flaws that are not acceptable to filmmakers. Guess not. Excellent.

  20. #20
    Senior Member Joan's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Imaging Resource already has some test shots at all ISO's up:

    http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/D90/D90A7.HTM

    Looks very good to me. What do you all think?
    Regards,
    Joan

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Joan,
    I looked at these earlier today. While I obviously don't have anything to directly compare, the ISO 3200's seem better than what I was getting from the D300. Others will need to chime in with their opinion. The D90 looks like it could be a very compelling camera.

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    rexyinc,
    Really did not think anybody was considering a D90 for a HD movie camera, but it could produce some nice clips. The discussion about the audio was more about being able to shoot something casually and easily and have a decent audio track, preferably in stereo, so as NOT to create the production scenario you describe. For example, being able to shoot a short clip of a conversation between folks at a party or cafe table. Not wiring them up and then matching sound to video afterword, as filmmakers would/should be doing. Smaller high end digicams, like the Canon S5 IS have built-in stereo mics, and/or a port to drop the audio right into the video track as it is recorded. This is not about making a film, but more about convenience at capture to have nice video clips with good sound. Yes, a true video camera and synced sound with mics for speakers, etc., nicely edited would be the filmmaker's tools and preferences. This does not look to be the primary purpose of the D90. Instead, it is capable of capturing nice HD clips, which can be dropped into a film and have audio tracks synced with them in production. But for somebody just wanting to get some clips of their kids/family doing stuff without all the other gear for filmmaking, the D90 is a couple steps in that direction....good video, pedestrian audio. I think that is all that was trying to be conveyed here.

    LJ

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    LJ,
    As I have been reading on some other forums what has some people intrigued beyond the casual clips is the sensor size and the control over the DOF. I know virtually nothing about video but from what I gather the ability to get the equivalent DOF like the D90 it is big bucks on video cameras and lenses. But, since I really don't have a base knowledge I don't have good bullsh*t radar about what I'm reading.

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    I think we were all taking past each other a bit. I was thinking of semi-professional possibilities, and wasn't so concerned about causal clips. Even if it's not designed for semi-pro work, if it does this job, it is some kind of mini-revolution. Also because it's, visually, a very different tool to standard semi-pro cameras.

    However, I don't know a lot about this, and am trying my best not to BS too much.

    Does anybody know if these files are suited for easy editing?
    Last edited by sizifo; 28th August 2008 at 17:20.

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by TEBnewyork View Post
    LJ,
    As I have been reading on some other forums what has some people intrigued beyond the casual clips is the sensor size and the control over the DOF. I know virtually nothing about video but from what I gather the ability to get the equivalent DOF like the D90 it is big bucks on video cameras and lenses. But, since I really don't have a base knowledge I don't have good bullsh*t radar about what I'm reading.
    Terry,
    I think that is pretty much the point.....here is a camera (D90) with a pretty decent sensor that is way bigger than most DV cameras and all digicams, AND it can mount some seriously nice glass to the front of it for effects that are near impossible to get with anything except higher end pro video cameras. For $1k, that is pretty impressive for sure. The HD video capture from it is impressive. I could see using this with something like a 85/1.4 to do some really nice creative shooting. In that case, one would want to "pull focus" manually anyway. The DOF would be the kind of stuff you only see in movies from those really expensive pro rigs. That is very cool for sure.

    The entire audio thing is a separate issue. I just find those shortcomings a bit, well, short. Not a deal breaker for some at all, and for those that would want to use the video part only and do their own audio, that makes it moot. So, for a small DSLR, it has this video feature capability that is pretty impressive, and has a variety of use options that can push it up the scale. It is not designed as movie camera, but the features let it play there to a much more sophisticated degree than most other things.

    My comments were more about having a camera like this and expecting to be able to let it do a lot of double-duty, like the Canon S5 IS does for many folks. Takes respectable digicam stills, and pretty decent video with good audio also. The D90 is capable of capturing far better video that can be used much more creatively. Its audio is boring and mono. Most folks might not see that as a bad trade-off. Those wanting to shoot nice, easy, simple home movie type stuff may not enjoy it as much even though the video part can blow away most other stuff out there right now. (Picture doing kids piano recital for example.....you could get really nice close-ups and stuff with lots of feeling, but unless you ran a separate audio, it would sound rather unimpressive, to say the least. That is all I was trying to discuss.

    LJ

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    Senior Member Joan's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by TEBnewyork View Post
    Joan,
    I looked at these earlier today. While I obviously don't have anything to directly compare, the ISO 3200's seem better than what I was getting from the D300. Others will need to chime in with their opinion. The D90 looks like it could be a very compelling camera.
    Good to hear, Terry, thanks. Will keep my eyes open for more samples and hope a full review will be happening soon. This is definitely going to be on my short list, all depends on what happens with m4/3 in the next few months, if anything.
    Regards,
    Joan

  27. #27
    rexyinc
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    Re: canon didn't see it coming

    Just spoke to one of the engineers ( his a mate and client of mine ) of the upcoming 3d & 7d's ( the 5d replacements ) he said they will look into adding HD video to the next generation.. ie: way too late now to add a major feature like this to the units pitty as I had a whole list of 'must haves' I wanted added to the video feature..

    opps - wrong forum - sorry guys.. i'll repost in the canon one. - Tony
    Last edited by rexyinc; 28th August 2008 at 20:26.

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by LJL View Post
    Terry,
    I think that is pretty much the point.....here is a camera (D90) with a pretty decent sensor that is way bigger than most DV cameras and all digicams, AND it can mount some seriously nice glass to the front of it for effects that are near impossible to get with anything except higher end pro video cameras. For $1k, that is pretty impressive for sure. The HD video capture from it is impressive. I could see using this with something like a 85/1.4 to do some really nice creative shooting. In that case, one would want to "pull focus" manually anyway. The DOF would be the kind of stuff you only see in movies from those really expensive pro rigs. That is very cool for sure.
    Yeah, but you can't watch it out of the camera. Well, you can but it will look like crap.

    Back to that 24fps "cinema" thing. Why 24fps for a DSLR doing video? Nikon is not into cheezy gimmicky stuff. And no one...no one in a $1k camera frame of mind, has a need for 24fps. You cannot watch it on your computer/display without converting to 30fps. That means for every 3 frames the screen wants to displayed, there is only 2 frames worth of data available from the Nikon. Ok, so there is magic in a box (software) that will fake 30fps from 24fps worth of data (3:2 pull-down), some better than others, but why? Why is Nikon there at 24fps?

    There is no way Nikon is going to invest in 24fps video just for a $1k camera. Nikon does not work that way. Could there be more to this video thing than Nikon is letting out right now?

    Humm...wasn't there something kicking around about an ad for a big Nikon event planned at the next (2009) WPPI? It said Nikon would debut something that was supposed to blow the socks off of wedding photogs? What kinds of imaging do brides buy? Do you need sound for wedding videos? And where does 24fps fit into a high-end video editing workflow?

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxide Blu View Post

    There is no way Nikon is going to invest in 24fps video just for a $1k camera. Nikon does not work that way. Could there be more to this video thing than Nikon is letting out right now?
    Of course there is. As opposed to Sony and Canon, Nikon has no market share to defend in the pro video market. My guess is that Nikon's next top camera doesn't just have 24MP, but 24MP full frame video as well, more than good enough for any news coverage and for most other purposes as well. If that isn't any PJ's dream, I don't know what is.

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    Of course there is. As opposed to Sony and Canon, Nikon has no market share to defend in the pro video market. My guess is that Nikon's next top camera doesn't just have 24MP, but 24MP full frame video as well, more than good enough for any news coverage and for most other purposes as well. If that isn't any PJ's dream, I don't know what is.
    Just out of interest, 1280x720 isn't enough for news coverage?

    Anyway, I do have the impression this is the first glimpse of revolution. In 10 years sports photographers will fondly remember the times when they were clicking away.

  31. #31
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by sizifo View Post

    Anyway, I do have the impression this is the first glimpse of revolution.

    I'm not so sure it is a revolution as much as it is a done deal. I'm thinking Nikon has this DSLR+video thing mapped out (planned) well into the next decade.

    That 24fps thing just ain't right. And Nikon knows it, so there is some reason they went with 24fps video. Oh to be the fly on the wall when the minds are meeting ...

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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxide Blu View Post
    I'm not so sure it is a revolution as much as it is a done deal. I'm thinking Nikon has this DSLR+video thing mapped out (planned) well into the next decade.

    That 24fps thing just ain't right. And Nikon knows it, so there is some reason they went with 24fps video. Oh to be the fly on the wall when the minds are meeting ...
    Revolution and done deal don't exclude each other, and I'm sure they didn't just stumble on this. What's surprising is they seem to be in front of Canon & Sony.

    Don't understand the significance of 24fps.

  33. #33
    Subscriber Member Jorgen Udvang's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    Quote Originally Posted by sizifo View Post
    Just out of interest, 1280x720 isn't enough for news coverage?
    You're right of course. Sometimes my fingers are faster than my brain

    Still, for professional applications, the D90 body isn't ideal. The ability to take 24MP stills and 1280x720 video by the flip of a switch opens up some new possibilities though, particularly for media who publish in print as well as electronically.

    These are fascinating times

  34. #34
    rexyinc
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    Wink Re: Nikon D90 is here

    yes very smart thinking and your right on the mark..

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    You're right of course. Sometimes my fingers are faster than my brain

    Still, for professional applications, the D90 body isn't ideal. The ability to take 24MP stills and 1280x720 video by the flip of a switch opens up some new possibilities though, particularly for media who publish in print as well as electronically.

    These are fascinating times

  35. #35
    rexyinc
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    Re: Nikon D90 is here

    mmm just wondering, what speed does flash video top out at ? anyone have a copy of flash handy?

    'Telecine removal
    Telecine removal maintains video quality by removing the extra frames that are added (3:2 pull down) when film (24 frames per second) is transferred to video (30 frames per second).'

    http://www.sorensonmedia.com/pages/?pageID=3

    now to research what a telecine is lol.. been a long while since i've done video in flash.. 2005 to now in internet years is like i'm 30yrs out of date now right?

    am reading http://www.kenstone.net/fcp_homepage...ema_tools.html
    and http://www.kenstone.net/fcp_homepage...ovies_fcp.html now. this kenstone site is going to come in very useful for getting up to speed again with this video stuff!


    Quote Originally Posted by Oxide Blu View Post
    That 24fps thing just ain't right. And Nikon knows it, so there is some reason they went with 24fps video. Oh to be the fly on the wall when the minds are meeting ...
    Last edited by rexyinc; 30th August 2008 at 19:20. Reason: doing some research

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