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New M11

vs-foto

Active member
 

Paul2660

Well-known member
Still trying to understand why a 60MP sensor only gets 50MP output on raw? I assume jpgs are 60MP? Also have you heard if this is a Sony Sensor or other? Also assume its a BSI sensor which by design may have Phase Detect AF built into the sensor, which the M11 will not need.

Paul
 

Paul Spinnler

Active member
I heard it is basically a two-year old Sony sensor. Nothing special. Leica needs to improve profitability and therefore doing your own custom CMOS for a bit of a different look has been given up for Sony colours and their dynamic range. Easier to pay 150-200 USD per sensor than to front 15m USD dev costs for a new custom sensor.

M11 is basically:

60 MPX Sony sensor (1-2y old design) with focus on low light in the marketing
Better battery compartment setup (finally)

They unfortunately missed out on:

IBIS
Hybrid EVF or any crazy evolution such as AF capability
 
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GrahamWelland

Subscriber & Workshop Member
I would expect a slew of YouTube pundits rushing to get out their “reviews” immediately after the embargo as I’m sure that they were all over in Wetzler before Christmas; I know that my “dealer” was present. (As in my photography crack dealer :) )
 

JeffK

Well-known member
I thought about leveraging my IQ260A for IR astrophotography, but now that the James Webb has unfurled it's heat shield, I'll just wait for what those folks get out of that fancy camera about to arrive at L2.
 

SrMphoto

Active member
Still trying to understand why a 60MP sensor only gets 50MP output on raw? I assume jpgs are 60MP? Also have you heard if this is a Sony Sensor or other? Also assume its a BSI sensor which by design may have Phase Detect AF built into the sensor, which the M11 will not need.

Paul
It is not clear to me if 50 MP is the largest reduced raw version or largest raw resolution.
Using the latest Sony 60MP sensor does not mean that OSPDAF must be included. The PDAF pixels are part of the topping, not of the underlying silicon.
I hope it will have dual conversion gain.
 

Paul2660

Well-known member
As the M series are out of reach for me (practicality vs cost), I do wonder if a SL3 is in the works for 2023 or late 2022. With the same sensor the M11 has. That would be a most interesting camera.

Paul
 
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iiiNelson

Well-known member
I would’ve guessed that they would’ve used the 33 megapixel sensor since it’s newer and probably a more manageable resolution size.
 

glenerrolrd

Workshop Member
I heard it is basically a two-year old Sony sensor. Nothing special. Leica needs to improve profitability and therefore doing your own custom CMOS for a bit of a different look has been given up for Sony colours and their dynamic range. Easier to pay 150-200 USD per sensor than to front 15m USD dev costs for a new custom sensor.

M11 is basically:

60 MPX Sony sensor (1-2y old design) with focus on low light in the marketing
Better battery compartment setup (finally)

They unfortunately missed out on:

IBIS
Hybrid EVF or any crazy evolution such as AF capability
Leica isn t building M cameras for customers that want an EVF camera . They are building them for their legacy customers who love rangefinder cameras and using Leica M lenses .

The M sensor has to have a thin cover and micro lenses to handle the Leica M wide angles . It also doesn t have to support any AF layer .

How the cameras firmware and processor is set up affects how the exposure values are mapped into zones . How color is reproduced etc .

Look at how well Hasselblad and Fuji have done with OLD 50MP medium format sensors .

The relevant question should be how is the new M11 better than the M10R . BSI , 60mps verse 40mps . Will this matter in practical usage .
 

SrMphoto

Active member
It is surprising how many M owners want an EVF-only M camera. I can only see a point in an M with a hybrid viewer, as long as the rangefinder experience is maintained.
I do not think Leica could reduce the resolution from 40MP to 33MP. After all, M11 is considered an upgrade to M10-R, not M10-P. Furthermore, higher resolutions likely reduce issues with false colors.
 

JeRuFo

Active member
I quite like the look of the sensor outperforming the lens to a degree. That's why I still like shooting LF film. It gives a more relaxed look and it better captures the character of a lens. I'm fine with sensors getting too good for the lenses that can be produced and I don't think I'd necessarily want better lenses than the ones produced today. Time to shift the focus to handling and UI again when that happens.
 

algrove

Well-known member
Electronic shutter will be interesting. No ND filters on fast lenses. I only have one. Might need more fast lenses. Classic fast lenses? G.A.S. again.
 

Paul Spinnler

Active member
SL3 is certainly being planned and I'd assume 60 MPX is next step. A new sony sensor would give it a different look but then again we'd get proper dynamic range. What bothers me most about the SL2 is the DR ...
 

Shashin

Well-known member
It sounds like a motorway...

It is a nice refinement to the M line. I am sure it will be a nice camera and owners will enjoying using it--with possibly enjoying the Leica customer service Leica is famous for. ;)

As far as the sensor resolution vs focus accuracy and optics, it is really a non-issue. The imaging will not be softer (unless you are pixel peeping). Prints from this camera will be just like previous versions. Sensor resolution does not change sharpness nor is it wasted. (And if you want the sharpest, highest resolution images possible, why are you buying a rangefinder?)

I expect great work to be made with this camera. Fortunately, Graham looks like one of the first to show us. ;) Fun with the Leica M11 thread anyone?
 
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