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Thread: M8 B&W

  1. #1
    Senior Member irakly's Avatar
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    M8 B&W

    M8 has a very unusual property when it comes to B&W conversion. I have not been able to reproduce this look with any other digital camera.

  2. #2
    roberth
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    Re: M8 B&W

    and how was this one managed?

  3. #3
    Senior Member irakly's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    lightroom only. no presets, just desaturation and adjustment of contrast, black, fill and exposure. this works, however, only on ISO640 and 1250. 2500 is too coarse while 320 does not give enough grain.

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    Senior Member Peter Klein's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    This looks a lot like the results we used to get when pushing Tri-X to 1600 and higher in the 1970s. There is a difference, however--something a bit more uniform in the "grain" and a bit more tonality in the mid-tones. It's one more example of the M8's "film-like" qualities at high ISO.

    Does the tic-tac-toe game suggest that "nobody wins?"

    --Peter

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    I agree Irakly, even to the use of 640 and 1250. Moreover, I find the M8 B&W the closest digital option to traditional B&W emulsions available. I think (and it's only a theory) that the IR "leak" makes the M8 sensor closer to the spectral response of traditional film. And FTR I shoot it all the time without the added IR-cut filters for this reason.

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    Senior Member helenhill's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Wow Irakly

    Who needs to Draw Anymore........
    B&W Conversion .....Its Magnificent
    A perfect Charcoal Moody Sketch
    This has Creatively Spun me in a New Direction
    the only purpose to drawing would be to distort

    thanx
    Best, helen
    Last edited by helenhill; 28th April 2008 at 17:17.

  7. #7
    Senior Member irakly's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Klein View Post
    This looks a lot like the results we used to get when pushing Tri-X to 1600 and higher in the 1970s. There is a difference, however--something a bit more uniform in the "grain" and a bit more tonality in the mid-tones. It's one more example of the M8's "film-like" qualities at high ISO.

    Does the tic-tac-toe game suggest that "nobody wins?"

    --Peter
    i used to push agfa apx 400 two stops and print on graded contrasty paper. to get even more dramatic results i would make a kodak technical pan negative dupe from an agfa scala transparency. it is just so much easier now

  8. #8
    Super Duper
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    Re: M8 B&W

    I looked at this image a lot of times on the DPreview thread and the lips captivated me. Even with the starkness of the contrast they still remain "soft" in tone and it is what draws me in. I know you like to shoot square. Do you think square when you are composing on the M8?

  9. #9
    Senior Member irakly's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Quote Originally Posted by helenhill View Post
    Wow Irakly

    Who needs to Draw Anymore........
    B&W Conversion .....Its Magnificent
    A perfect Charcoal Moody Sketch
    This has Creatively Spun me in a New Direction
    the only purpose to drawing would be to distort

    thanx
    Best, helen
    maybe it was a good thing that they kicked me out of an art school when i was nine. otherwise i would know how to do this with charcoal, but not with a camera

  10. #10
    Senior Member irakly's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Quote Originally Posted by TEBnewyork View Post
    I looked at this image a lot of times on the DPreview thread and the lips captivated me. Even with the starkness of the contrast they still remain "soft" in tone and it is what draws me in. I know you like to shoot square. Do you think square when you are composing on the M8?
    i absolutely do. i used to have this lovely russian medium format rangefinder "iskra" that shot 6x6. i want a digital one like that!

  11. #11
    Workshop Member tollie's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Hi,

    I was really struck with your conversion and so was prompted to give it a try. The following image was taken this weekend at a wedding I shot...

    640ISO M8 Summarit 90

  12. #12
    Senior Member irakly's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    tollie, this one seems to have a little to much fill. you can see that in grainy patches in the hair and on a shoulder of a man behind the bride. i think, if you decrease the amount of fill, the picture will look sharper too. now it is a bit hard to look at because of this slight sense of motion blur.

  13. #13
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    Re: M8 B&W

    I really like effect you have demonstrated Irakly. However, after trying it on a few of my images i couldn't get anything as good as your example. I suspect I don't have good images to start with. Would you care to show a "before" example of the photo you posted to give us an idea of a type of photo which is a good starting point?

  14. #14
    Senior Member irakly's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Mark, any normally exposed photo shot at ISO640-1250 is a good starting point. All you have to do is boost contrast to the maximum and then adjust black-fill-exposure.
    I am writing from a laptop, no raw files here.
    I guess, I have to include a topic "hardware specific lightroom techniques" in one of my courses or workshops

  15. #15
    roberth
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    Re: M8 B&W

    magnificent technique and I must try this myslef as well.

  16. #16
    Workshop Member tollie's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Hi,

    Thanks for the feedback.

    I reduced fill to 66 from 100 and I boosted recovery to 73.

    What do you think?

  17. #17
    Subscriber gogopix's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Quote Originally Posted by irakly View Post
    Mark, any normally exposed photo shot at ISO640-1250 is a good starting point. All you have to do is boost contrast to the maximum and then adjust black-fill-exposure.
    I am writing from a laptop, no raw files here.
    I guess, I have to include a topic "hardware specific lightroom techniques" in one of my courses or workshops
    Images as this always get me to try 'variations on a theme' no right way. whether it is music, or art (Rheins catherdrale)
    or photography.
    It would be interesting to try, each figure in mirror, other out, both in, both out that with one or both in both places.

    Mirror is a great way to play with image ambiguity.

    also clothing, on off etc, though that is harder.

    very good shot. Pls take nthe right way, but I think one of the variations might produce a great shot.

    (but then again you wouldnt post the BEST here! Not after Guy's or someone talking about image theft.)

    regards
    Victor

  18. #18
    Senior Member irakly's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Quote Originally Posted by tollie View Post
    Hi,

    Thanks for the feedback.

    I reduced fill to 66 from 100 and I boosted recovery to 73.

    What do you think?
    much better. now increase clarity to about 50% (if you are in LR1.x) and play with sharpness sliders (mainly radius and detail holding the amount at 25 or below). also see what happens if you decrease recovery to about 50% and increase contrast if it is not at 100% already.

  19. #19
    Senior Member irakly's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    i don't care about image theft. what can one do with a 72dpi 600x900 image? make a crappy unsigned 8x12" print? be my guest people who steal images do not buy them anyway. if a photo is stolen for commercial web use, digimark tracks my images on the web and sends by-weekly updates. when my lawyer hears about another stolen photo, his eyes light up
    this particular image just was nominated for a "2007 photographer of the year" award and is for sale in one of the largest photo galleries in Moscow. four copies have already been sold, and one print is on a wall in a living room of a deputy of minister of culture of portugal

    Quote Originally Posted by gogopix View Post
    Images as this always get me to try 'variations on a theme' no right way. whether it is music, or art (Rheins catherdrale)
    or photography.
    It would be interesting to try, each figure in mirror, other out, both in, both out that with one or both in both places.

    Mirror is a great way to play with image ambiguity.

    also clothing, on off etc, though that is harder.

    very good shot. Pls take nthe right way, but I think one of the variations might produce a great shot.

    (but then again you wouldnt post the BEST here! Not after Guy's or someone talking about image theft.)

    regards
    Victor

  20. #20
    Workshop Member tollie's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Hi,


    OK... here we go.
    Clarity had been adjusted previously to 64...
    sharpness to 21 with radius and detail maxed out.
    recovery decreased to 50

    oh... previously I tarted it up with a bit of blue tint and a touch of vignetting

    ta ta:

  21. #21
    Subscriber gogopix's Avatar
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    Re: M8 B&W

    Quote Originally Posted by irakly View Post
    i this particular image just was nominated for a "2007 photographer of the year" award and is for sale in one of the largest photo galleries in Moscow. four copies have already been sold, and one print is on a wall in a living room of a deputy of minister of culture of portugal
    so I guess I am not alone in thinking it was very good

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