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Thread: Sorry, we're closed!

  1. #1
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    Sorry, we're closed!

    Hey Guys,

    after having all those fine cameras in my studio (H4D-40, Leica S, Nikon D800E) and a final shooting with both cameras (H4D & D800E), I decided to go out of MF business. The last two years have been feeling great with my Hasselblads, but for my type of work, there is so much more flow in my shootings with a smaller cam.

    What makes me really sad is that I'll be no longer be allowed to post in the gorgeous "Fun with MF" thread, but will check back for your wonderful pictures regulary. Watch out for the Nikon-Subforum or maybe on facebook/stan.ROX

    If you want to see the picture that finally flipped the switch klick here (3.4 MB)
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    Member chaosphere's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    MF or not, your images will still be a pleasure for the eyes
    Matías Antoniassi
    www.matantoniassi.com
    www.facebook.com/matantoniassi
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Stan,

    a few points I would like to ask you in this context (out of interest):

    1) Was your decision driven by financial value motives primarily (IQ difference not discernible, DR not really that much better, upgrade costs too high in your view etc.)

    or

    2) usability aspects (faster shooting, insane battery life, live view, size, weight)?

    You are a working pro. Don't you think that showing up with a camera on set that your client's kid/wife can't afford (i.e. a nice Hassy worth 20k+) is a differentiator?

    What about the look of MF? It is not the same ... you know you love the 100 2.2 look!

    Regards

    Paul
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Spinnler View Post
    Stan,

    a few points I would like to ask you in this context (out of interest):

    1) Was your decision driven by financial value motives primarily (IQ difference not discernible, DR not really that much better, upgrade costs too high in your view etc.)

    or

    2) usability aspects (faster shooting, insane battery life, live view, size, weight)?

    You are a working pro. Don't you think that showing up with a camera on set that your client's kid/wife can't afford (i.e. a nice Hassy worth 20k+) is a differentiator?

    What about the look of MF? It is not the same ... you know you love the 100 2.2 look!

    Regards

    Paul
    Paul,

    I would have LOVED to stay in Medium format. Almost everybody stood paralyzed when I took out the big iron, made from stainless steel! Oh, that shine. Followed by:

    "Uh, wait. I need to remove the battery ... the camera must be reset"

    "Stay there, need a second for the Autofocus"

    "OK, give me a second need to change the battery"

    Very simply spoken (such a decision goes not that easy and I have thought about for some reasonable time) the decision-driver was the lack of differentiation between the two systems.

    If I would make a living from Landscapes or Interior shootings, I would rather do a upgrade (mpix-wise) or extend my kit - but for Beauty, Lingerie and Nudes a 500 USD-Lens (Nikon 85 1.8 G) takes up easily with the HC 100 (check it out here). (Let alone the fact that this picture is purely lit with two Nikon SB-910 controlled via CLS).

    Finally: Approaching a shooting site, I carry enough equipment with me to impress almost everybody. Big flashes, small flashes, tripods, my Airport Thinktank International filled up with lenses etc etc. - never had any question, but they know my work.

    I just consider this as a new chapter in my work - I've been with Canon for 10 years until I sold everything - sometimes its a good thing to reboot.

    There are, however, still some unedited MF-Pictures on my Harddisk :-)

    S.
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Stan,

    thank you for your comments.

    But you know ... never say never! In 5 years you might wind up buying a H5D-40 for 5k on this forum ...
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    Senior Member johnnygoesdigital's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Paul Spinner-"You are a working pro. Don't you think that showing up with a camera on set that your client's kid/wife can't afford (i.e. a nice Hassy worth 20k+) is a differentiator?"

    The difference shows in the photographer's skill, not what looks good to egomaniacs. A professional photographer is just that...professional, otherwise have the clients kid/wife take the photos. Clients are looking for creativity and inspiration-evident in the photographers mastery of the tools, because if you show up with an expensive MFD camera and still suck...hmmm.

    I haven't used a MFD camera yet that matches the dynamic range of the D800, and as Stan has pointed out the 85mm is one of the best lenses period. There's a certain look to MFD, for me it's DOF, and skin tones, but I can achieve that perceived look with the D800 - a camera that is superior in dynamic range, and to me, more useful then the logo on the side of the camera.
    I personally think that one's creativity and professionalism shows in the lighting and use of modifiers. That's what will make you stand out from the crowd, and besides think of how many more lights/modifiers you can get when getting into the D800 over MFD. Your profit/margin just increased simply by choosing the right tools over ego.
    I should point out that this applies to my situation and obviously not all photographers are applicable, but If someone is more concerned by their sense of self importance than a clients needs, then you better be a good photographer.
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Interesting to read this, Stan. I'm on my way into MF digital, but see that going for a studio only solution based on my GX680 for product and food photography would make sense for me and stay with Nikon for faster paced work.

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnygoesdigital View Post
    Paul Spinner-"You are a working pro. Don't you think that showing up with a camera on set that your client's kid/wife can't afford (i.e. a nice Hassy worth 20k+) is a differentiator?"

    The difference shows in the photographer's skill, not what looks good to egomaniacs. A professional photographer is just that...professional, otherwise have the clients kid/wife take the photos. Clients are looking for creativity and inspiration-evident in the photographers mastery of the tools, because if you show up with an expensive MFD camera and still suck...hmmm.

    I haven't used a MFD camera yet that matches the dynamic range of the D800, and as Stan has pointed out the 85mm is one of the best lenses period. There's a certain look to MFD, for me it's DOF, and skin tones, but I can achieve that perceived look with the D800 - a camera that is superior in dynamic range, and to me, more useful then the logo on the side of the camera.
    I personally think that one's creativity and professionalism shows in the lighting and use of modifiers. That's what will make you stand out from the crowd, and besides think of how many more lights/modifiers you can get when getting into the D800 over MFD. Your profit/margin just increased simply by choosing the right tools over ego.
    I should point out that this applies to my situation and obviously not all photographers are applicable, but If someone is more concerned by their sense of self importance than a clients needs, then you better be a good photographer.
    Johnny, I am fully aware that it is the photographer that is most important factor in the equation. But as I see it, the main benefit from MFD nowadays is "marketing". It does make a difference when you impress the client and give him the feeling that he is buying the best quality money can buy. it doesnt matter then, if the camera could have been a Nikon D800 ... what matters is perceived value which is a combination of the output and the impression that one paid for a photographer that uses equipment one doesnt also have. To me it makes a difference if I were to hire a photographer and he arrived on set with a Canon 60D and kit lens ...
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    Interesting to read this, Stan. I'm on my way into MF digital, but see that going for a studio only solution based on my GX680 for product and food photography would make sense for me and stay with Nikon for faster paced work.
    It's always nice to have two systems for diffrent types of work. This sounds like a nice setup for you. This also reduces limitations on one system no question. Reaching into your cabinet and grabbing the best tool for the work your going to shoot that day is bliss. Having options is wonderful.having limitations just sucks.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    With all due respect Paul, Imo, I think the client is impressed with what they are given in the product, and not the perception of what brand of camera their holding before the shoot. I'm not sure the average client knows the fundamental differences anyway. As far as marketing is concerned for MFD, I could use a camera that costs ten times as much as a D800 that does so much less in terms of functionality, then my perception would be that the photographer is more concerned with their impression and not the other way around. Digital photography today is blending and evolving to a point where only a photographers intuition and skill will set them apart.

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Going back to the heart of this thread and for Pros more than anyone these types of decisions are based mainly on money output versus money input. If a piece of gear will not increase revenue than its very hard to justify from a business standpoint. Let me also add to this the basic problem is US and our desire or want as a person not a business to have gear regardless of the ROI. I know its a battle for me and I know I'm not alone is the battle between my wants and business needs. I find from a Pros seat that whatever gets the job done and done correctly regardless of what's in your hand as a good thing. I'm shooting the Nikons its a very good solution for me but I would still rather shoot MF but that's okay too. Sometimes your just forced into things and need to accept them and not worry about it. My heads in a good place on these decisions and frankly I would rather not stress over gear anymore. I have enough things to stress about. I think many Pros worry about the next gig coming in the door as our main concern.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnygoesdigital View Post
    With all due respect Paul, Imo, I think the client is impressed with what they are given in the product, and not the perception of what brand of camera their holding before the shoot. I'm not sure the average client knows the fundamental differences anyway. As far as marketing is concerned for MFD, I could use a camera that costs ten times as much as a D800 that does so much less in terms of functionality, then my perception would be that the photographer is more concerned with their impression and not the other way around. Digital photography today is blending and evolving to a point where only a photographers intuition and skill will set them apart.
    It is my opinion, just that.

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    I don't disagree with the perceived value when a photographer shows up with MF gear. I did get a lot of attention with that and yes it does have some market value in regards to they hired a top gun to shoot there product. What does come into play though is how much percentage of value does your client put on that. I have one big client that seen me go up to MF from a P25 to as high as a IQ 160 than seen me go down to the Nikon. I still get hired regardless but it does impress them but we have to ask ourselves the value of that as well. I'm all for looking the part but that takes a lot of things and gear is only a part of that being a good honest, hard working, ill do whatever it takes attitude takes on a much more perceived value to a client. I won't deny gear impressions on clients, but I always asked myself what if any role that plays to the bottom line. But I agree looking the part will not hurt you either.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnygoesdigital View Post
    With all due respect Paul, Imo, I think the client is impressed with what they are given in the product, and not the perception of what brand of camera their holding before the shoot. I'm not sure the average client knows the fundamental differences anyway. As far as marketing is concerned for MFD, I could use a camera that costs ten times as much as a D800 that does so much less in terms of functionality, then my perception would be that the photographer is more concerned with their impression and not the other way around. Digital photography today is blending and evolving to a point where only a photographers intuition and skill will set them apart.
    In my experience results should, and often do matter more than the perception of professionalism.

    But the trappings of professionalism almost always matter a little, and often matter a lot. Doctors wear white jackets for a reason beyond their ability to show germ-carrying-dirt/grime easier (see this podcast about the Placebo effect). Part of the trappings of professionalism is your attitude, punctuality, communication skills, business cards, website, and even small things like posture.

    But part of the trappings of professionalism is also gear including the camera, lens, lighting, and even the cases/grip/accessories.

    Show up with great trappings of professionalism but produce poor results and you're likely not to get hired again. But if you have the choice between great results with or without great professionalism I think the choice is clear.

    The camera is only a small part of that, but it is part of that for sure.

    This is one of the reasons I've always thought medium format companies were smart to keep backs within a given line (e.g. all of the P+ backs) identically styled. Other than a small marker in the corner of the back a P20 and a P65+ look the same as do an IQ140 and IQ280, despite very large differences in price and spec. You don't own a PXX+... you own a Phase One digital back.
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    It's a interesting topic and you always wonder what if any real effect this has. I know I get hired because I deliver the goods always, that I can hang my hat on. Big companies hire consultants to query these things, it would be interesting to figure this out but none of us has the resources like that to put our money into figuring it out. You can get a good idea from the clients you work for and to stay in business you need to know what makes them happy.

    I can see how this debate can go several ways and believe me I have thought about it a lot. Not sure there is truly a wrong answer either as clients are as diverse in thinking as we are as photographers. But yea it begs the 64k question does it really pay off.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Senior Member johnnygoesdigital's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    These are excellent points, I do shoot MF, but mostly film. Certainly it's not wrong to invest in MFD, but if it's just to look good as a perception then the resulting photographs better show the same effort.
    Last edited by johnnygoesdigital; 2nd July 2013 at 09:20.

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Sorry to see you leave, Stan - but will catch up with your work on the Nikon forum.
    Stunning photo BTW.
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by Stan ROX View Post

    If you want to see the picture that finally flipped the switch klick here (3.4 MB)
    Sorry, but could you please point out which pictures on your web site are taken by your HCD-40 or Leica S?

    Just feel curious.


    Xin

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by Stan ROX View Post
    If you want to see the picture that finally flipped the switch klick here (3.4 MB)
    Well, as hairy chests go, it probably would have flipped my switch too. (Certainly can't argue about a lack of resolving power!)

    On a more serious note, life as an amateur is a lot easier and I can certainly understand the needs of a working professional. Your description of your Hasselblad battery/focus/battery/lock up etc sounds very familiar to my DF experience for a long time, although thankfully it's a lot better these days. When the gear becomes a block to creativity or business then it's time to go.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"
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    Senior Member RVB's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by Stan ROX View Post
    Paul,

    I would have LOVED to stay in Medium format. Almost everybody stood paralyzed when I took out the big iron, made from stainless steel! Oh, that shine. Followed by:

    "Uh, wait. I need to remove the battery ... the camera must be reset"

    "Stay there, need a second for the Autofocus"

    "OK, give me a second need to change the battery"

    Very simply spoken (such a decision goes not that easy and I have thought about for some reasonable time) the decision-driver was the lack of differentiation between the two systems.

    If I would make a living from Landscapes or Interior shootings, I would rather do a upgrade (mpix-wise) or extend my kit - but for Beauty, Lingerie and Nudes a 500 USD-Lens (Nikon 85 1.8 G) takes up easily with the HC 100 (check it out here). (Let alone the fact that this picture is purely lit with two Nikon SB-910 controlled via CLS).

    Finally: Approaching a shooting site, I carry enough equipment with me to impress almost everybody. Big flashes, small flashes, tripods, my Airport Thinktank International filled up with lenses etc etc. - never had any question, but they know my work.

    I just consider this as a new chapter in my work - I've been with Canon for 10 years until I sold everything - sometimes its a good thing to reboot.

    There are, however, still some unedited MF-Pictures on my Harddisk :-)

    S.
    You might miss those Leaf shutter's at some point Stan,or the giant viewfinder,bit no doubt the D800E is very impressive camera,and those images are gorgeous....

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by chaosphere View Post
    MF or not, your images will still be a pleasure for the eyes
    +1

    I appreciate the thread and your explanations, Stan. Quite informative.
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Well at least within colleagues I´m again and again astonished.
    I thought it is out of discussion that the man makes the image not the camera.

    I am sure if you give Stan a 500 $ starter DSLR he will still make better images than most people even with an 80 Mpix "Heavy Iron".

    Have fun
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    That is all fine, Stefan, some of the resaons that Stan spells out quite clearly are quite revealing of the current state of the affairs with MF digital and that of the smaller format ones.
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Yes , you are right Vivek.

    Today another thing happened that may make the situation even more difficult: even if the 70d may not be a highend camera the new autofocus will probably be groundbraking.

    That´s what I always say, usability is the core, resolution is probably second grade from a certain amount of pixels onward.

    Professional is what works best to get a result the customer pays for.
    Nothing else.

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    I prefer much more the handling with the H4D50 over the Nikons (have only D4 and D600). Its a bit slower, thats great. The Hassy AF is pretty fast and sometimes its also difficult for the Nikon AF to find the point. How many shot I missed, because the Nikon AF was searching... I go never out of Power with the Hassy, 2 Akkus are enough for a hole day shooting. To reset, I had the Hassy this year maybe one time. And I really love to work with the Hassy files over the Nikon files.
    In January I lost my hole Hassy Gear and more in L.A. Then I started again to evaluate what system I will, starting again with zero. Checked again the Leica S, but now I have again a H4d50 (before the 40er). And soon the H5D50. And I'm in love again;-)). The Nikons I really use when is now way to work with the Hassy. The most time I have both cameras with me. But I must also say, the most people I shoot for are (if in any case) more impressed from the D4 than from the Hassy. (Nearly) nobody knows the Hasselblad... And I would love to speak better english, but now I'm learning Italiano Have fun. And Stan, you have always great pictures.
    rem
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Never got the same CONSISTENT results with Nikon than with the S2, and I'm making almost the same type of work. This is mostly due to the small viewfinder of the Nikon and the unprecise AF - point in it. and probalby my bad eyes. When you shoot studio as you do, then the 85 AFS is a marvelous lens, because once stopped down it deliveres also consistent results. But when bokeh counts and accurate AF then the Leica-System is unmatched (for me) . The S2 is flawless, consistent, reliable. And this phantastic viewfinder.

    Btw I used the S2 also over a long time with several SB900 via Pocketwizzards and still use this setup when needed.
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by rem View Post
    I prefer much more the handling with the H4D50 over the Nikons (have only D4 and D600). Its a bit slower, thats great. The Hassy AF is pretty fast and sometimes its also difficult for the Nikon AF to find the point. How many shot I missed, because the Nikon AF was searching... I go never out of Power with the Hassy, 2 Akkus are enough for a hole day shooting. To reset, I had the Hassy this year maybe one time. And I really love to work with the Hassy files over the Nikon files.
    In January I lost my hole Hassy Gear and more in L.A. Then I started again to evaluate what system I will, starting again with zero. Checked again the Leica S, but now I have again a H4d50 (before the 40er). And soon the H5D50. And I'm in love again;-)). The Nikons I really use when is now way to work with the Hassy. The most time I have both cameras with me. But I must also say, the most people I shoot for are (if in any case) more impressed from the D4 than from the Hassy. (Nearly) nobody knows the Hasselblad... And I would love to speak better english, but now I'm learning Italiano Have fun. And Stan, you have always great pictures.
    rem

    I found this interesting. I will add "the view finder"
    The first time you look into a H4D viewfinder is amazing. The clarity, the apparent size of the view etc.

    I found more difference between the H4D and the full frame Nikons, between the Full frames and the dx cameras.

    I am surprised by the auto focus bit. Canon is far ahead at this moment in terms of autofocus, but I don't feel like my Nikons Hunt that much. Could you elaborate a little?

    The D800 have been a "change your heart machine" few moths after it's introduction.

    Have you work with it? What make you peek the D600 over the D800 since you have all the speed in the World with the D4?

    Thanks,

    James

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Well done Stan. It's hard to make such a decision. I'm sure it was not without significant cost.

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    In my experience results should, and often do matter more than the perception of professionalism.

    But the trappings of professionalism almost always matter a little, and often matter a lot. Doctors wear white jackets for a reason beyond their ability to show germ-carrying-dirt/grime easier (see this podcast about the Placebo effect). Part of the trappings of professionalism is your attitude, punctuality, communication skills, business cards, website, and even small things like posture.

    But part of the trappings of professionalism is also gear including the camera, lens, lighting, and even the cases/grip/accessories.

    Show up with great trappings of professionalism but produce poor results and you're likely not to get hired again. But if you have the choice between great results with or without great professionalism I think the choice is clear.

    The camera is only a small part of that, but it is part of that for sure.

    This is one of the reasons I've always thought medium format companies were smart to keep backs within a given line (e.g. all of the P+ backs) identically styled. Other than a small marker in the corner of the back a P20 and a P65+ look the same as do an IQ140 and IQ280, despite very large differences in price and spec. You don't own a PXX+... you own a Phase One digital back.
    great post, I agree.

    When we are talking about professional photography we are talking about a professional service.

    As in any service industry the tools are only one part of the equation. And in photography the camera/lens is just one of many tools that include lighting and grip equipment, camera support equipment and computer and processing equipment.

    A lot of people can make a good image but not a lot can provide consistent, reliable, high quality responsible service and a good experience for the customer. (I can add a few more adjectives!)

    In regards to camera gear I use what I think its best for the job. Most times for paid job's it's my Canon gear due to working speed (capturing, client display/approval and post-processing) and lens choices. (although the H1/80mm is great for studio work)

    For my personal work I am using mostly the IQ160 w/ the Arca (w/ HR40 and 70 lenses) or the H1/80mm.

    Stan, It's unfortunate you had such a bad experience with the Hasselblad in regards to AF and the Battery performance / camera reset issues. So far With the H1/IQ160 combination I have had no issues in that regard. It has been solid so far. Love it for photographing people.

  30. #30
    Senior Member johnnygoesdigital's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Agreed, the H1/H2 with a DB seem better suited and more reliable than the digital only H's. I had several H3d/H4d's before switching to the H2...great camera. Now just need a P25+!

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnygoesdigital View Post
    ...
    There's a certain look to MFD, for me it's DOF, and skin tones
    ...
    No!, not only DOF and skin tones

    On a larger format system the image produced by the lens is better to begin with : Larger size = shift to lower spatial frequencies = using the lens in a better zone of its Modulation Transfer Function = better overall micro-contrast = higher fidelity (to use an audio term) / lifelikeness.
    You could say that between equivalent “images” produced by a lens on different formats systems there are more “analogical details” in the larger image.

    No need to use extremely sharp lenses to get 25Mpx max of useful details like with a D800!

    Why nobody "defends" MF even here on a MF forum!?
    Mhh maybe it deserve to die? when even Phase-One CEO can only come up with "differentiation" as the main advantage for MF! (c.f. his ~recent video interview)

    ('should start a thread about all that)

  32. #32
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    I owned 5 Phase digital backs and DF and Cambo tech cam system and they are wonderful image makers but there is also no ****ing reason to defend it as it stands on its own. Its a mindless debate and in the end no one really gives a crap as we will work with whatever tool will best fit our needs. I have been shooting digital only since 1990 thats 23 years and let me tell you we NEVER even dreamed of these kinds of systems and quality we are getting even in the mirrorless world. Consider us lucky as hell because 23 years ago you would give your eye teeth just to have a decent file to work with. People need to really get over this comparison crap as at the end of the day if you cant shoot worth **** anyway no gear is going to save your ***. There I said it, spend your money on learning how to shoot and be a great artist instead of spending 3k on a lens just because some idiot says its better than anything else on the market. Really who died and made him king.

    Thats my morning 3 espresso rant dont let me get to 4. ROTFLMAO

    Okay, okay, I know I know I should be much more subtle in my approach and I'm half kidding but those debates are what drives me away from even reading these forums never mind being a big part of them. Bottom line I don't care what name is on them , don't care what format it is and I don't care what Joe dick head is shooting either . What I do care about is what I can get from it and if it works, not to mention as a a Pro I make some money from it.

    edouard be assured Im not picking on you and your post.

    No offense to anyone named Joe either. LOL

    I'm just having a little fun this morning before i do a bunch of printing
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
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  33. #33
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    BTW Happy July 4Th.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
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    Senior Member Joe Colson's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    ...I don't care what Joe dick head is shooting either.
    I resemble that remark.

    Joe
    _________________________________
    Joe Colson Photography
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  35. #35
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    I actually thought of you Joe not that I was referring to you but it made me put the disclaimer in. ROTFLMAO

    I probably should have worded that a little different but oh we'll.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Side stepping Guy's post so I don't get yelled at... Haha, jk!

    I shoot with an H4x and an IQ140 and love eveything about it. As with most MFD shooters, I've gone through a progression of backs and I've also tried basically every camera platform. To me there is a quality difference and other reasons why I made my decision to "invest" in it. Impressing clients didn't factor into it at all. But you can be damn sure I tell them how high quality, top of the line and expensive my equipment is when the opportunity presents itself. They aren't hiring me because of the camera, but when it comes time to negotiate, it helps. When they try to negotiate down, I can use that as a reason of why they should pay me more.

    The bottom line, it's about the image you create. You can make close to the same image with any of the pro cameras out there today. Maybe thinking about it as having both an art and business side. Whichever camera you prefer to use factors into the art side. The business side can be what affect the perception of what you are using has on your clients. And let me be clear, I'm not saying you will look more impressive simply by having a MFD. the equipment should match your style and you can pitch it anyway you want. Look at Terry Richardson, his thing was a point and shoot. It became his brand. We all stand out in different ways, the camera you choose in many ways reflects that. I'm referring to your personality, personal style, etc. and I think that happens without you realizing it.

    Happy 4th!!!

  37. #37
    Senior Member EH21's Avatar
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    Quote Originally Posted by Stan ROX View Post
    Paul,

    "Uh, wait. I need to remove the battery ... the camera must be reset"

    "Stay there, need a second for the Autofocus"

    Those are familiar expressions to me, and ever since I started shooting film again alongside digital, I can add a break for changing films too. But I'm still happier with the look of the MF files, both digital and film, but the film skin looks great and needs less retouching. If I were doing sets for websites or something, I'd probably be happier with the DSLR's since they have quicker AF and need less light, but for artwork and fewer images, I'm happier with the look of the larger formats.
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  38. #38
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    Re: Sorry, we're closed!

    I am an art director in advertising field, for both prints and TV commercials. I was a film shooter from 135 to 4x5 and acquired Leica S2 set last year for some serious personal works.

    The quality of MFD is great, I always know this, because my photographers all using MFD and one is using Credo80. If I can choose the system for my jobs, I will simply ask for the MFD first then DSLR. You will never know if the clients suddenly wants a 5m billboard, and the retouching cost is the same. (My retouchers never talk about high mp files issues, though we all know it has much more works to do).

    I was tempted to get a MFD system simply because of the quality. Before that, my cameras were Pentax 67ii and Leica, I simply ignore Leica because the film size is too tiny.

    However, after 7 months and 2500 shots, I sold my whole S2 system (S2-P, S70, HC100 + Adaptor, plus many manual lenses) and got a DSLR + an X100s now.

    It's nothing concern the quality, but just a personal preference.

    1.
    I feel quite annoying to refocus every shot because I don't put my subject on centre.

    2.
    The dof on MFD is a magic, however, I also feel the dof is just too shallow even at f11. You will still get OOF photos sometimes.

    3.
    The lenses cost are simply too high for personal projects. With the MFD, I want the highest quality lenses, I used some vintage lenses and the area outside centre were unacceptable even at f8. I can't afford what I need, however, or I would say I couldn't justify the cost. It's another story, though.

    4.
    Speed was fine to me, because I shoot slowly, for a normal portrait session, I only do 20-30 shots including several poses. But it required lots of light which is an issue, because I don't have assistants and my lights were not big enough, with a beauty dish + grid, it's ok, but i simply can't go for smaller aperture like f11.

    5.
    I love to shoot outdoor, but the iso and minimum handheld speed were another issues, it's a relative thing, it affects dof, sharpness, success rates and other thing. With MFD, I simply want the best quality, which means the lowest iso. But I should say iso320 on S2 is very nice too.

    The above are my personal reasons, and I would agree that if I have a team, a MFD is always the top priority.

    I may be back.

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