Some good info from a GFX owner

[Paul2660]

I heard that Fuji subscribed to Lloyd and have decided to pull the camera from the market. Lloyd was sure there was no way to check for focus shift which was wrong he also implied that the Fuji lens corrections for diffraction applied to raw again which is not the case. If you attempt to review a product with a predetermined opinion the review to me takes on much less importance.

As for Jim K to be honest I would be a bit more respectful. His methods may seem strange but his background in engineering is impressive.

Paul Caldwell

 

[tashley]

Thought he is a Zeiss ambassador, Tim.

Oh I see. Yes I think he is. But I'm generally happy, personally, to accept reviews from ambassadors who have a good track record of being straight about their affiliations. However if someone has an official position on the payroll in a very significant role, I'd he surprised if they wrote reviews unless they were extremely explicit about where they were coming from.

 

[MGrayson]

As for Jim K to be honest I would be a bit more respectful. His methods may seem strange but his background in engineering is impressive.

I have spent my life around some of the most impressive minds of the past few generations (and boy, is that tough on the ego). They can make errors just as easily and frequently as anyone else. Argument from authority is dangerous.

Having said that, I have always enjoyed Jim K's writing and find his approach and thinking on many topics careful and clear. Yet nothing written about equipment is worth as much as some time spent using it yourself, IMHO.

--Matt

 

[siddhaarta]

If you attempt to review a product with a predetermined opinion the review to me takes on much less importance.

Paul Caldwell

I don't think that he had a predetermined opinion. If so, he wanted to be the GFX the better alternative as he had some problems with the ergonomics of the X1D. But as soon as he had the camera in his hands, his opinion changed drastically.

The points, I personally found most important and critical:

- He could not get results as sharp with manual focus as with AF (if it worked)
- Manual focus does not stay after reviewing pictures
- The focus shift problem with the 120mm at FAR distances (now confirmed with a second sample)

 

[jdphoto]

I just wonder if any of you do actually use the gear? Fan boys, pixel peepers, resolution junkies will never be satisfied and that's why subscription sites do very nicely, and planned obsolescence is a marketing success. Digital photography has once again been diluted to the mundane. No originality because everyone can do it, it seems. I don't care as much about tech as I do about the user interface and for me, that's one of the reasons I won't get the GFX. I would prefer native leaf shutter lenses too and only the X1D seems to have that for mirrorless MFD cameras. Don't get me wrong beta reviews are important, but obsessing over every detail or feature isn't.

 

[mjr]

I can only call what I see, shooting aurora the other night, focussing wide open on stars which is obviously pretty critical, I can review, turn the camera off, move to a new spot and turn it back on again and the manual focus returns exactly as I put it, I tried today with checking focus after reviewing and turning the camera on and off and find exactly the same thing, the lens returns to the same spot, at least on my camera. The Leica S I had was a complete nightmare for that, it recycled the lens every time it woke up or was turned on and never returned to the same spot, very annoying on a shoot!

As for this Jim guy, I don't care what his background is, I'm only looking at his published test and I find it absurd, I would be impressed if he had a background as a world champion hoola hooper, still wouldn't change my opinion of his test. Obviously though I am not his target reader, I am sure there will be many who like it.

Mat

 

[tashley]

I just wonder if any of you do actually use the gear? Fan boys, pixel peepers, resolution junkies will never be satisfied and that's why subscription sites do very nicely, and digital photography has once again been diluted to the mundane. No originality because everyone can do it, it seems. I don't care as much about tech as I do about the user interface and for me, that's the reason I won't get the GFX.

That could come across as somewhere in the insulting/patronising ballpark... it seems to me that the majority of us here actually do use our gear.

 

[mjr]

I just wonder if any of you do actually use the gear? Fan boys, pixel peepers, resolution junkies will never be satisfied and that's why subscription sites do very nicely, and digital photography has once again been diluted to the mundane. No originality because everyone can do it, it seems. I don't care as much about tech as I do about the user interface and for me, that's the reason I won't get the GFX.

What didn't you like about the interface JD?

 

[Paul2660]

I don't think that he had a predetermined opinion. If so, he wanted to be the GFX the better alternative as he had some problems with the ergonomics of the X1D. But as soon as he had the camera in his hands, his opinion changed drastically.

The points, I personally found most important and critical:

- He could not get results as sharp with manual focus as with AF (if it worked)
- Manual focus does not stay after reviewing pictures
- The focus shift problem with the 120mm at FAR distances (now confirmed with a second sample)

Again, that is LLoyd's opinion, take it as you wish.

He is not a fan of any X series camera, period. It's only natural that would predetermined his opinion. As for his faults,

1. no problems for me going between manual focus and AF, to me it's no different than using Live View on a D810 or K1, the later having peaking. The peaking on the GFX is vastly improved over previous peaking solutions by Fuji for x series cameras.
2. known design issue with Fuji, as all the X series cameras have this problem due to focus by wire. I would have preferred that Fuji use a manual clutch on their GF lenses as they used to use on the X series. However by just hitting AF-L one time you can quickly regain the
previous focus point.
3. Focus shift, to me Focus shift is greatly over-rated. Just as for years similar comments were made about the Nikon 14-24, to be honest I never have seen to be that great an issue. Now that he knows how to set the lens correctly to check for it, it doesn't surprise me that
some Focus shfit is there, however for my work I have not noticed it at distance. In fact the 120mm with OIS has turned out to be an amazingly sharp lens, and can be easily hand held.

There are some issues for sure, but overall the camera has excellent potential, and in the past Fuji does have a history of providing firmware to fix some issues, however the MF/AF clutch won't be one of these. The non use of LM in the 63mm and 45mm is also a problem at least for me. The LM in the zoom and 120mm allows for much faster AF and less hunting.



Paul Caldwell

 

[Paul2660]

I can only call what I see, shooting aurora the other night, focussing wide open on stars which is obviously pretty critical, I can review, turn the camera off, move to a new spot and turn it back on again and the manual focus returns exactly as I put it, I tried today with checking focus after reviewing and turning the camera on and off and find exactly the same thing, the lens returns to the same spot, at least on my camera. The Leica S I had was a complete nightmare for that, it recycled the lens every time it woke up or was turned on and never returned to the same spot, very annoying on a shoot!

As for this Jim guy, I don't care what his background is, I'm only looking at his published test and I find it absurd, I would be impressed if he had a background as a world champion hoola hooper, still wouldn't change my opinion of his test. Obviously though I am not his target reader, I am sure there will be many who like it.

Mat

I concur with this and it totally surprised me as the X-series cameras will not allow this. When the camera notices the problem you will get the focus check message. So as you point out, this a great asset for night work with this camera. Hoping that Fuji doesn't change it back to how the X series camera work in the future. If you jump from Shoot mode to playback, you will get the focus check message however.

Paul Caldwell

 

[mjr]

Paul

Not personally seen a focus check message I don't think, I have gone from shooting to play back hundreds of times now and not had to refocus, maybe it's the 63 that is different to what other people are seeing, not sure.

Mat

 

[hcubell]

Lloyd...also implied that the Fuji lens corrections for diffraction applied to raw again which is not the case. If you attempt to review a product with a predetermined opinion the review to me takes on much less importance.



Paul Caldwell

Actually, I asked Jim Kasson about that. He appeared to confirm that there is a considerable amount of sharpening embedded into the GFX raw files. Here's part of what he had to say:

"If you want to see what a GFX image looks like with no sharpening, run the RAF file through X-Transformer with all sharpening (X-transformer and Lr) turned off. Then import the resultant DNG to Lr and make sure sharpening is set to zero.

If you look at a file out of X-Transformer with all sharpening off, you'll see that it needs a bunch [of sharpening]."

You can argue about whether that is good or bad. Some may say that Fuji can do a better job of optimizing the sharpening of the GFX files in the firmware than most of us could do manually in LR.

 

[jdphoto]

What didn't you like about the interface JD?

First off, I admire Fuji for going in this direction because it creates competition. Fuji's weather sealing is also a plus, but I need a faster sync for strobes and native lenses, not adapted lenses. The GFX is a wee bit too bulky for me and I prefer the a simpler interface with less buttons.

 

[mjr]

I agree, if you need leaf shutter lenses then it doesn't matter about the rest of the system, it's not the right one. I'm using mine with a set of Hensel strobes and it works perfectly but I'm not outside overpowering the sun wide open with it so as it stands it's not an issue for my work.

As for interface, having the D810 here beside the GFX, I find the Fuji much nicer to control, I don't go for all the dials, they are locked off and I only operate from the body, aperture, speed and ISO are all very easy, I then have timer on a button which is easier than rotating the Nikon dial, I have bracketing on a button which is one press and turning exposure simulation off for strobe work on another and that's it, the only other thing I have is virtual horizon on the top button of the thumb grip, this is really nice to tap with the thumb and bring up, I don't use anything else and never have to go in to menu at all, now I have worked out you can reformat by holding the delete button for a second and pressing the rear dial.

There are things I don't like for sure, the first is the playback image doesn't stay with the orientation of the camera, I'd prefer it if rotating the camera would leave the playback image upright. I also don't like when shooting in portrait mode handheld and reviewing an image, holding the camera as normal, zooming in or moving the image around with your left hand, the eye sensor gets triggeres and turns the rear screen off, I think the eye sensor should just disable when in playback mode. Don't like the Q button, it's sometimes easy to activate it, especially when on a tripod in portrait orientation and the camera is lower than you, moving it around I hit the button, would rather just disable it but no option for that at the moment.

Other than that, I really like this camera, couldn't care less how it looks, with a face like mine, even a pretty camera isn't going to help!

Good that there are options for everyone.

Mat

 

[voidshatter]

As for this Jim guy, I don't care what his background is, I'm only looking at his published test and I find it absurd, I would be impressed if he had a background as a world champion hoola hooper, still wouldn't change my opinion of his test. Obviously though I am not his target reader, I am sure there will be many who like it.

Mat

Unfortunately, digital cameras have to be designed by people with a background in engineering. Maybe digital cameras should be designed by people with a background in photography, so more photographers in gear forums can be more satisfied :grin:

 

[Shashin]

Hi,

Jim Kasson is a retired electrical engineer and colour scientist with a life long passion for photography. Jim recently started shooting with his Fuji GFX system and he seems to be quiet impressed by the system.

Be warned, Jim is a scientist at heart, so he takes an engineering approach checking out stuff.

But not so much of an engineer and scientist to understand the problems of testing optics through a window at infinity.

 

[kdphotography]

Just a dirty window lit by the sunrise. I usually open it for photography.

It's the one on the right.



Sorry, getting :OT:!

--Matt

That's a huge camera filter, Matt. It must be a bitch to take with you on location...:ROTFL:

 

[Paul2660]

Mat, good find.

I was coming at the GFX as I did all previous X series cameras. So all three lenses show this same behavior, in that turning off the camera in M mode doesn't allow for loss of previous focus point. This was never the case with the X cameras (unless latest 2.0 firmware changes it). You do however lose it when you go to playback mode for sure and will see the focus check notice. For me the change is a good one. It also appears that you don't lose the focus point if you acquire it with AF, then mode to M mode, again something that the X series cameras do not do as you get the focus check. Re-reading the manual mentions nothing really about this. For sure the manual was written at very high level and more detailed info would have been nice.

On the point of sharpening, I also agree with Jim that something is embedded as I noticed right off that no additional sharpening was needed in LR/ACR, which has never been the case with Fuji. Not sure if this is lens optimization info or something else. I called Fuji US about a week ago on the Lens optimization question and they told me it could only work on jpg or raw conversion in camera. I always leave it on in case I wanting to work with a jpg for some reason.

Paul Caldwell

 

[Paul2660]

One other note, on flash the GFX does support HSS and can use it with the Fuji EF-X500, which I have used several times past 1/125. I realize this is only one flash and not a strobe setup. I am not sure what the statement of support for HSS and external strobes is by Fuji.

Paul Caldwell

 

[Quentin_Bargate]

Jim's comparisons are valid, even if shooting out of an unopened window is obviously not.