Michiel Schierbeek
Well-known member
Re: Fun with the A7/7R
The A7r leaves more room for cropping.
(white balance corrected )
The A7r leaves more room for cropping.
(white balance corrected )
Great to see you here. Join our insightful photographic forum today and start tapping into a huge wealth of photographic knowledge. Completing our simple registration process will allow you to gain access to exclusive content, add your own topics and posts, share your work and connect with other members through your own private inbox! And don’t forget to say hi!
The A7R image seem to have sharpening applied to it. There is also more contrast in the A7R image. That might be in-camera and to do with differences in exposure and optic. Those alone will give the appearance of it being "better" than the D800e. That can be be changed in Photoshop in seconds.I fully agree. Such tests are challenging even when comparing the same camera/lens combination to itself. OTOH, despite the slight difference in focus points between the images, I would say it's undebatable that the A7R image shows significantly more detail and to me, it also shows more 'presence' and three-dimensionality.
We were discussing the difference between A7 and A7R. The same lens was used on both cameras. I provided the D800E image for reference only. A valid comparison is impossible in this case, since a different lens was used for this image. The same sharpening settings were applied to all three images in LR, and WB was set using the color checker present in the test scene. Otherwise, all settings were at their LR defaults.The A7R image seem to have sharpening applied to it. There is also more contrast in the A7R image. That might be in-camera and to do with differences in exposure and optic. Those alone will give the appearance of it being "better" than the D800e. That can be be changed in Photoshop in seconds.
I don't think your conclusion is "undebatable."
Bob,Looks like it in the clouds...so go to PS and use the color sampler...read on lt and rt in the sky/clouds and in the trees....should show a shift in R values if this is so.
Bob
I really doubt that this is shift caused by the lens or adapter.Again, it is measurable, but whether it is of practical significance is debatable.
Which is why I suggested earlier to shoot a white targetI really doubt that this is shift caused by the lens or adapter.
Cindy, if you have doubts, just take two pictures back to back, one with the camera upside-down.
The sky is not perfectly even in terms of color, people. If there was no measurable difference in color between over here and over there when the sun was at an oblique angle, that's when I'd get worried!
I really doubt that this is shift caused by the lens or adapter.
Cindy, if you have doubts, just take two pictures back to back, one with the camera upside-down.
The sky is not perfectly even in terms of color, people. If there was no measurable difference in color between over here and over there when the sun was at an oblique angle, that's when I'd get worried!
Cindy, I haven't seen the color shift on any of your pics either. If it is there it must be very very slight. In that last shot I doubt that lens would have any color shift with the lens used. On my NEX I never saw the magenta issues until I started pointing my RF lenses at blue skies. I wouldn't worry about it if I was you.Taylor, I would not have noticed it until it was brought to my attention yesterday. That is very sensible advice that you have given me. Before I put this to rest, I am going to shoot a white background as Ron previously suggested, and I will turn the camera over as you suggest. Then I can go back to enjoying this camera.
fotoingo, far be it from me to bring common sense to the proceedings but, are you really judging the best camera to buy based on how it handles lenses it wasn't designed to use, from different manufacturers, some of which are old and not even designed for this type of camera? These expensive lenses that happen to fit this body because third party companies have decided to build cheap (in comparison to the lenses and body) adapters so that they will physically fit? The camera doesn't know what they are or in some cases what aperture they are set at? This is the basis for any decision on what is worth buying? I don't understand!My opinion on A7 vs A7R in general :
Get the A7.
It is
cheaper
has faster flash sync
more fps
build feels the same as the A7R
same weight as A7R
picture quality is the same (even though the A7R has more pixels)
usability is better with RF lenses. (much less hassle with magenta cast)
smearing seems to be the same with both A7s
AF is a tiny bit faster
smaller file sizes
I will keep my A7 and my friend with the A7R is about to send it back and getting a A7 too.
How would one subscribe to that logic for M or D800 users or any other camera system that people adapt lenses to that not originally designed for the camera. If the image is the sum of the parts plus the photographer I don't see how it's "flawed" provided the artistic image of the photographer was captured in the way intended.fotoingo, far be it from me to bring common sense to the proceedings but, are you really judging the best camera to buy based on how it handles lenses it wasn't designed to use, from different manufacturers, some of which are old and not even designed for this type of camera? These expensive lenses that happen to fit this body because third party companies have decided to build cheap (in comparison to the lenses and body) adapters so that they will physically fit? The camera doesn't know what they are or in some cases what aperture they are set at? This is the basis for any decision on what is worth buying? I don't understand!
This camera to me is flawed with anything other than the Sony lenses it was designed to be used with, it may produce reasonable results by luck but there's none of the huge amount of processing that goes on internally with the M240 for example or the D800 or many other cameras that are designed for a specific range of lenses.
For me, this camera will only work if the results from the camera when lenses designed for it are mounted are superb, how it happens to work with some random adapter can not be surprising when the results are less than optimum.
There are a few great images on this thread, it would be excellent to see what this camera can really do rather than lots of posts on what it can't do, just my own opinion.
Mat
Cindy, IMO it is impossible to evaluate such a scene for absolutes. Especially subtile ones which may or may not be natural phenomena. The scene in question appears brighter on the left ... which is natural lighting ... this often produces a bit more magenta because of slightly more IR intensity.Bob,
I had already done that. I'm not seeing the shift on my NEC. I will re-calibrate it tomorrow and see if I can see it. The values on the left were 181, 189, 206. On the right 170, 180, 199. About an inch lower on the left 165, 179, 206 and on the right 145, 163, 196. I am thinking that if this is significant, it is indicating that my sensor is not sitting straight. I had a different lens and adapter on the camera today.
Hiredarm, I don't subscribe any logic to leica R lenses working well on the D800, the R lenses happen to work well in some cases, if they didn't it wouldn't be down to the D800 being a bad camera or a good one. If the D800 worked badly with Nikon lenses then it would be a bad camera.How would one subscribe to that logic for M or D800 users that use R lenses not originally designed for the camera. If the image is the sum of the parts plus the photographer I don't see how it's "flawed" provided the artistic image of the photographer was captured in the way intended.
It all depends on what your aims are. Being able to use the A7R as a compact FFDB for just about all the glass I already own is definitely what interests me most about this camera. It costs a lot less than the lenses I'm going to use it with, and based on what I've seen so far, I'm expecting it to work well for the kind of photography that I do. Hence, I don't think it's that absurd of a decision…What I'm saying is that deciding which is better, the 7 or the 7r based on how it works with non native lenses is absurd.