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Selling stuff

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
I have too much gear, and as I had an unexpected and very unwelcome expense a few weeks ago, I decided to get rid of some of it. My original plan was to sell the D700 and some lenses that I don't use much. However, when selling things that aren't current these days, one has to sell a lot, even if all or most of it were the greatest gadgets on earth just a few years ago. So I turned the tables and asked myself what would bring in the most money and still have the least impact on my photography. The answer was simple:

The Nikkor 200-500mm is almost new, it's amazingly sharp, has little or no CA or other distortions and is a popular lens which is easy to sell. The VR is amazing as well. I've taken some 5,000 photos with it during the 2 months that I've owned it. However, it's also a very "sterile" lens, with little depth and boring colours. It's a lens that really needs Photoshop for the images to come alive. Add to that the plastic build quality (it feels like a 70-300 on steroids), and it's not something that I would take to race events or other places where I bump into things and people. It served its purpose at the Singapore Airshow. The next airshow down there is in 2018. I can buy a new one then.

The D810 is in my view the best DSLR ever made, which makes it an easy sell. My guess is that at least within a year, possibly before Photokina, there will be a D820 in a body with all the features of the D500 and then some, and obviously with an even better sensor. When that happens, the price will fall. So, I'm selling it now. It's already at the shop.

The D700 has little commercial value now, but is still a great camera, so that's the Nikon body I'm keeping (in addition to some old DX bodies that I use for sports photography). I'll mostly use it with the Zeiss 21mm, the Nikkor 50mm f/1.2 AiS, the Nikkor 105mm f/1.8 AiS and the 180mm AF.

Will I miss the D810? If anything, I'll miss the image quality at ISO 64, but I can live with that. Most people won't notice, and I'm back to challenging myself, with no room for cropping and more concentration before each click. I like that, and I'm very happy to have a "lighter" kit.

Obviously, being a gearhead way beyond saving, I can't go into a camera shop with getting something back. By coincidence, the shop that is selling my gear had a lightly used E-M1 for sale for less than $500. I say "had", since they now don't have it anymore. So, I'm back to two systems again. This makes perfect sense, doesn't it? :D :ROTFL:
 

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
Perfectly !
Congrats with your "new" E-M1.
Don't forget that you need lenses for it ... at least the 300/4, the 40-150/2.8, and the 12-40/2.8 :p

CU,
Rafael
Ha ha... there are dangers around every corner :)

The 12-40 range is mostly covered by the 14-50mm. I'll consider a WA lens and maybe the 40-150 (or the 100-400) plus the 75mm. Apart from that, I'll try to stay away from camera shops :ROTFL:
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
All I can say is, "Oh boy..."

:LOL:

Personally, I think you'll end up regretting BOTH these sales. IMHO, the 200-500 is the tele bargain of the century, and while it is easy to replace, there is no guarantee you'll get one that is as awesome as the one you now own seems to be, at least judging from the pictures you've posted. (Remember that as we approach optical perfection, the minor optical anomalies that added character in days gone by get corrected away.) The D810 is likely the camera I won't ever part with, even with the new D900 or D1000 or whatever -- it simply renders in such a clean way that I am skeptical anything newer or higher resolution will replicate it anytime soon; yes it will have more pixels, and probably even superior noise/ISO characteristics, but I own maybe 2 lenses now that can take full advantage of D810 resolution now. And in many ways the sensor renders a look that is unique, like the D4/Df sensor does for those cams. To wit, look at the "new" Sony A7rii sensor -- IMHO not visibly superior -- and in many ways inferior -- to the A7r; and of course I find the D810 superior to the A7r even though they are essentially the same sensor.

Of course, this is all personal preference and I fully respect that YMMV...
 

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
All I can say is, "Oh boy..."

:LOL:

Personally, I think you'll end up regretting BOTH these sales. IMHO, the 200-500 is the tele bargain of the century, and while it is easy to replace, there is no guarantee you'll get one that is as awesome as the one you now own seems to be, at least judging from the pictures you've posted. (Remember that as we approach optical perfection, the minor optical anomalies that added character in days gone by get corrected away.) The D810 is likely the camera I won't ever part with, even with the new D900 or D1000 or whatever -- it simply renders in such a clean way that I am skeptical anything newer or higher resolution will replicate it anytime soon; yes it will have more pixels, and probably even superior noise/ISO characteristics, but I own maybe 2 lenses now that can take full advantage of D810 resolution now. And in many ways the sensor renders a look that is unique, like the D4/Df sensor does for those cams. To wit, look at the "new" Sony A7rii sensor -- IMHO not visibly superior -- and in many ways inferior -- to the A7r; and of course I find the D810 superior to the A7r even though they are essentially the same sensor.

Of course, this is all personal preference and I fully respect that YMMV...
Thank you for your advice, Jack. Yes, I regret the sale already, but that's life. This solved a serious problem for me. There will be a D8xx for me later this year I hope, and hopefully a 300mm PF. If the D820 isn't any good, I'm sure the D810 will become cheaper than what I sold mine for anyway :)
 

Joe Colson

Well-known member
The D810 is likely the camera I won't ever part with, even with the new D900 or D1000 or whatever -- it simply renders in such a clean way that I am skeptical anything newer or higher resolution will replicate it anytime soon; yes it will have more pixels, and probably even superior noise/ISO characteristics.
Jack, I agree with your assessment of the D810 even though I now shoot with an a7RII. Jorgen will definitely have seller's remorse. Of all the Nikon cameras I've owned over the years, the D810 came closest to being the "sweet spot" for me. What pushed me to the Sony was neither DR, higher resolution nor noise/ISO performance but the ability to focus accurately and reliably regardless of lens selection. I'm 68+ and my aging vision finally required an EVF with magnification. Focus peaking, Live View, and a high resolution EVF with magnification have become "must haves" at this stage of my life. I was amused when your friend Lloyd Chambers came to the same conclusion (for possibly different reasons). We all get there eventually (if we're lucky).

The mistake I made was selling my Nikon lenses. Jorgen, if personal finances allow, don't sell your lenses. Yes, Nikon may introduce newer versions with enriched plutonium glass elements that completely eliminate aberrations and distortion, but the current set of available lenses, including the 200-500mm are pretty darned good.

For me, if Nikon were to introduce a mirrorless F-mount camera (with features similar to the Leica SL), employing the sensor from the D810, I'd jump back into the Nikon family in a heartbeat. And I'd have to re-buy all the lenses I sold when I left for Sony. :(

Joe
 
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Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
Jack, I agree with your assessment of the D810 even though I now shoot with an a7RII. Jorgen will definitely have seller's remorse. Of all the Nikon cameras I've owned over the years, the D810 came closest to being the "sweet spot" for me. What pushed me to the Sony was neither DR, higher resolution nor noise/ISO performance but the ability to focus accurately and reliably regardless of lens selection. I'm 68+ and my aging vision finally required an EVF with magnification. Focus peaking, Live View, and a high resolution EVF with magnification have become "must haves" at this stage of my life. I was amused when your friend Lloyd Chambers came to the same conclusion (for possibly different reasons). We all get there eventually (if we're lucky).

The mistake I made was selling my Nikon lenses. Jorgen, if personal finances allow, don't sell your lenses. Yes, Nikon may introduce newer versions with enriched plutonium glass elements that completely eliminate aberrations and distortion, but the current set of available lenses, including the 200-500mm are pretty darned good.

For me, if Nikon were to introduce a mirrorless F-mount camera (like the Leica SL), employing the sensor from the D810, I'd jump back into the Nikon family in a heartbeat. And I'd have to re-buy all the lenses I sold when I left for Sony. :(

Joe
Apart from the 200-500, I'm not selling any lenses. I'm tending towards liking older lenses more than the new ones, and most of those I have are rather old, so little commercial value anyway. I'm also keeping the D700 for now, and will use that one for some photography. The plan at the moment is to wait for the D810 replacement and decide then if I'm going to buy that camera, the D500 or another D810. Time will show.

At the moment, I try to figure out how the Olympus works. It's a complicated camera, and as opposed to the Panasonic that I had, it doesn't resemble the Nikon layout at all. What I have found is that the old PanaLeica 14-50mm zoom is still a stellar lens, but it should be, shouldn't it? It's around the same size as the Nikkor 24-120mm in spite of having a shorter zoom range and being designed for a sensor a quarter of the size. No wonder they don't make telecentric lenses for the 35mm format :shocked:
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
Seller's remorse? Eh, it's all just equipment to me. I sell as freely as I buy, as long as the prices are right. I've got to get my sales stuff up and going as I have a lot of gear to get rid of now that the Leica SL has proven itself. I think you've taken the right tack, Jorgen. :)

Olympus E-M1: I've pretty much moved all of my photography to using the Leicas now, but I can't seem to let go of the E-M1 yet. It just works well for so many things—a very handy camera.

G
 

tcdeveau

Active member
I recently sold all my Nikon gear for similar reasons and have been shooting with an X-T1 and A7R instead. They certainly have their merits, but I find the mirrorless cameras are more complicated and can be very frustrating to use in practice compared to the Nikon, and I definitely miss my D810. The D810 hit a sweet spot for me (and also the best 35mm dSLR to date IMHO) and I will most likely get another at some point in the future (and maybe a D810a too :p). Joe makes a great point about lenses and I wish I had held on to at least the 70-200 VRII, but the sale solved a more pressing $$ problem. Such is life.
-TC
 

ptomsu

Workshop Member
Jack, I agree with your assessment of the D810 even though I now shoot with an a7RII. Jorgen will definitely have seller's remorse. Of all the Nikon cameras I've owned over the years, the D810 came closest to being the "sweet spot" for me. What pushed me to the Sony was neither DR, higher resolution nor noise/ISO performance but the ability to focus accurately and reliably regardless of lens selection. I'm 68+ and my aging vision finally required an EVF with magnification. Focus peaking, Live View, and a high resolution EVF with magnification have become "must haves" at this stage of my life. I was amused when your friend Lloyd Chambers came to the same conclusion (for possibly different reasons). We all get there eventually (if we're lucky).

The mistake I made was selling my Nikon lenses. Jorgen, if personal finances allow, don't sell your lenses. Yes, Nikon may introduce newer versions with enriched plutonium glass elements that completely eliminate aberrations and distortion, but the current set of available lenses, including the 200-500mm are pretty darned good.

For me, if Nikon were to introduce a mirrorless F-mount camera (with features similar to the Leica SL), employing the sensor from the D810, I'd jump back into the Nikon family in a heartbeat. And I'd have to re-buy all the lenses I sold when I left for Sony. :(

Joe
I fully agree and if Nikon will bring a FF mirrorless based on the D810 sensor or some follow up, I would instantly go fully back into the Nikon ecosystem and stop looking around. Most probably even sell my loved Olympus EM1 and my even more loved Olympus Pro glass.

Time will tell and I think we will see within the next year at least what happens :cool:
 

ptomsu

Workshop Member
Apart from the 200-500, I'm not selling any lenses. I'm tending towards liking older lenses more than the new ones, and most of those I have are rather old, so little commercial value anyway. I'm also keeping the D700 for now, and will use that one for some photography. The plan at the moment is to wait for the D810 replacement and decide then if I'm going to buy that camera, the D500 or another D810. Time will show.

At the moment, I try to figure out how the Olympus works. It's a complicated camera, and as opposed to the Panasonic that I had, it doesn't resemble the Nikon layout at all. What I have found is that the old PanaLeica 14-50mm zoom is still a stellar lens, but it should be, shouldn't it? It's around the same size as the Nikkor 24-120mm in spite of having a shorter zoom range and being designed for a sensor a quarter of the size. No wonder they don't make telecentric lenses for the 35mm format :shocked:
Jorgen,

I am sure you will come back to Nikon with a D820 or D810 sooner than later!

Meanwhile just enjoy the EM1. It may look complicated at the first moment, but once you get accustomed to it it will soon turn out to be a very capable and flexible camera. It even can do pretty nice AFC sequences of airshows if you set it right - I proved that last summer and the results were pretty stunning - well in combination with the 2.8/40-150 Pro lens and attached 1.4 TC ;)

Peter
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
...At the moment, I try to figure out how the Olympus works. It's a complicated camera, and as opposed to the Panasonic that I had, it doesn't resemble the Nikon layout at all. ...
I had experience with several Olympus cameras when I bought the E-M1 so both their manuals and the menu structure was not off-putting to me at all. Be sure you download the latest instruction manual from the website, it includes information on the latest firmware revision. I recommend two things that aid me in learning the E-M1 (and any camera really):

  • Go to the end of the book where the tables of all the menus are listed out with the default settings and read through that section of the manual first. This gives you a geographic map of where the options in the menus are relative to each other, and it briefs you on the nomenclature that Olympus uses in naming and describing the features and controls.
  • Use the PDF I created (E-M1_Settings_BLANK.pdf) to create a cheat sheet of all your favorite settings once you have worked out a configuration that you like. It saves a tremendous amount of time if you reset the camera to have a menu by menu list of your settings to reconfigure the camera with. There are over 180 settings in the menus ...! (The cheat sheet may be slightly out of date, but it has enough to be useful. An example configuration I use is here: E-M1_Settings_EXAMPLE.pdf

G
 

bensonga

Active member
Jorgen....now I understand why you posted the pic with the E-M1 and 14-50 recently! The silver grill "brick wall" test photo. :) Coincidentally, I have a new E-M1 in the mail to me, in fact it arrived in Anchorage today and should be delivered on Friday. :)

Good decision to keep the D700....it's a classic and I'll never sell mine.

I have been debating with myself for almost a year whether to replace my D800e with a D810. Of the many cameras I own, the D800e is the camera I turn to most often when I absolutely want to get the best IQ with the least hassles. For me, it has been a rock solid performer. If I need to take just one camera and one lens (as I will for a photo shoot of my wife's Japanese Taiko drumming group this evening), it is the D800e and 24-120/4G ED VR lens. Still, I keep thinking about that D810. The value of a used D800/D800e has fallen so much, I probably wouldn't want to sell it, so that means ponying up another ~$3k for the 810.

Question for all you here who had or have both...am I likely to see a noticeable improvement in IQ or usability, given that I don't shoot sports, wildlife, etc and my demands re camera performance are much less than most people here?

Gary
 

Jack

Sr. Administrator
Staff member
Question for all you here who had or have both...am I likely to see a noticeable improvement in IQ or usability, given that I don't shoot sports, wildlife, etc and my demands re camera performance are much less than most people here?

Gary
The IQ differences are minimal, primarily a bit better color fidelity, a bit more DR, but to my eyes the biggest is notably better and more pleasant ISO noise. Operational differences are mainly AF speed and and AF accuracy, including manual focus lens focus confirm dot accuracy; and while AE accuracy was already excellent, it seems even better in the D810. Was it worth it? For me it absolutely turned out to be, but given the 2x delta in value over selling my used D800E I wasn't sure at the time. But then using it, I have not once missed the D800E since its departure. For me, the D810 is the most transparent camera in use I've owned to date, and my results are pretty much as good as it gets.

My .02 only...
 

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
The IQ differences are minimal, primarily a bit better color fidelity, a bit more DR, but to my eyes the biggest is notably better and more pleasant ISO noise. Operational differences are mainly AF speed and and AF accuracy, including manual focus lens focus confirm dot accuracy; and while AE accuracy was already excellent, it seems even better in the D810. Was it worth it? For me it absolutely turned out to be, but given the 2x delta in value over selling my used D800E I wasn't sure at the time. But then using it, I have not once missed the D800E since its departure. For me, the D810 is the most transparent camera in use I've owned to date, and my results are pretty much as good as it gets.

My .02 only...
Add to the above also group AF, which is what I've used most of the time and a much quieter shutter. Due to the more reliable focus dot, this is the first DSLR that I have been able to focus manual lenses reliably. I would also add the low contrast colour profile which in combination with ISO 64 and 31 gives more or less unlimited headroom for editing.
 

bensonga

Active member
The more accurate manual focus confirmation "dot" is just about enough to convince me.

Jorgen -- do you still have and use your D2xs?

Gary
 

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
The more accurate manual focus confirmation "dot" is just about enough to convince me.

Jorgen -- do you still have and use your D2xs?

Gary
I use the D2Xs for daytime sports events, but at the current rate, I won't wear it out within this millennium :rolleyes:
 

tcdeveau

Active member
Jorgen....now I understand why you posted the pic with the E-M1 and 14-50 recently! The silver grill "brick wall" test photo. :) Coincidentally, I have a new E-M1 in the mail to me, in fact it arrived in Anchorage today and should be delivered on Friday. :)

Good decision to keep the D700....it's a classic and I'll never sell mine.

I have been debating with myself for almost a year whether to replace my D800e with a D810. Of the many cameras I own, the D800e is the camera I turn to most often when I absolutely want to get the best IQ with the least hassles. For me, it has been a rock solid performer. If I need to take just one camera and one lens (as I will for a photo shoot of my wife's Japanese Taiko drumming group this evening), it is the D800e and 24-120/4G ED VR lens. Still, I keep thinking about that D810. The value of a used D800/D800e has fallen so much, I probably wouldn't want to sell it, so that means ponying up another ~$3k for the 810.

Question for all you here who had or have both...am I likely to see a noticeable improvement in IQ or usability, given that I don't shoot sports, wildlife, etc and my demands re camera performance are much less than most people here?

Gary
I owned both the D810 and the D800E and shot both simultaneously on several shoots. My thoughts echo what others have said. ISO noise was preferable on the D810 and the shutter is a lot quieter. AF was great too. I could be wrong and I never pixel peeped this much, but I think the D810 is a tad bit sharper as well due to the EFC. At the time I was weighing buying a new D810 or a second used D800E and I didn't regret going with the D810 at all.
 
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